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#1 26-07-12 22:15:45

Driver99
Member
Registered: 21-01-11
Posts: 264

Signalling for approaching junctions question

Does anyone, either as an ADI teaching learners or an ADI Part 3 trainer, NOT teach to apply a left or right turn signal irrespective of whether there are any road users to benefit during the MS phases of MSPSL, approaching a left or right turn, major to minor?

Would an Examiner fault a driver for not automatically applying a signal if no other road user would benefit?

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26-07-12 22:15:45

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Re: Signalling for approaching junctions question



#2 26-07-12 23:08:09

Terrier
Banned
From: Greater Manchester
Registered: 15-05-11
Posts: 657

Re: Signalling for approaching junctions question

Driver99

In theory if there was clearly no one to benefit and a signal was not given there is no fault to record. However, as a general rule, most instructors teaching learner drivers would advise a signal for turning at junctions regardless of whether anyone will benefit at that time.

I am aware that in Advanced test such as IAM / RoSPA a signal would not be given unless it's of benefit. The problem with learners is they have so much to think about at junctions, that if they leave the signal off and something changes where a signal would be required they are likely to miss it.

In DSA Essential Skills  or Highway Code, it does not say you must signal in any situation, it's all about whether it will help or warn other road users including pedestrians.
It's more important to make sure the signal timing is correct or if the signal would mislead or confuse another road users. A simple example of this is waiting to move off on a busy road and sitting with the right signal showing when it's obviously not safe to move off.

Hope this helps.


ADI Development Greater Manchester & Cheshire Grade 6 ORDIT Approved
Cardington Grade A  RoSPA Gold
DSA External Trainer Certificate for Instructor Training

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#3 27-07-12 07:10:20

Newrose
Member
From: burnley
Registered: 25-01-12
Posts: 44
Website

Re: Signalling for approaching junctions question

that if they leave the signal off and something changes where a signal would be required they are likely to miss it.

I completely agree with Terrier on that and also in case of a learner he/she may forget to give signal when one is required.

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#4 27-07-12 07:11:27

Promanade
Guest

Re: Signalling for approaching junctions question

Would an Examiner fault a driver for not automatically applying a signal if no other road user would benefit?
No


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#5 27-07-12 07:59:40

(ROG)
Verified Member
From: LEICESTER
Registered: 23-08-10
Posts: 1,551

Re: Signalling for approaching junctions question

Promanade wrote:

Would an Examiner fault a driver for not automatically applying a signal if no other road user would benefit?
No

Also no if an inapropriate signal was given and no one was about

Had a trainee do that on a LGV test - approached roundabout in left lane to go road ahead but signalled right using left lane until exit signal was needed but as no one else was about no fault was given


IAM Observer
Leicester group of advanced motorists
LGV instructor from 2005 to 2008

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#6 27-07-12 12:15:16

(ROG)
Verified Member
From: LEICESTER
Registered: 23-08-10
Posts: 1,551

Re: Signalling for approaching junctions question

My view on signalling is this ...

If an experienced driver is in a situation where good all round views show that there is nothing there and they signal then I wonder if their observations have been carried out correctly

If a learner in the same situation signals then I will assume it is part of their hazard routine so that should another come into view they will not have to interupt that routine which is keeping them as safe as possible


IAM Observer
Leicester group of advanced motorists
LGV instructor from 2005 to 2008

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#7 27-07-12 13:29:37

Driver99
Member
Registered: 21-01-11
Posts: 264

Re: Signalling for approaching junctions question

Helpful answers, thanks.

I like the idea of signal as long as it's not misleading, I was just thinking of two situations - one on Part 3 test with a smart ar$e examiner who might say "why are you telling me to signal - there's no one to benefit and DtES says I don't have to?" - the reply I've heard is to tell him there could be something in the minor road that we haven't seen yet.  To my mind, that's not a particularly valid reason, as the unseen car will see a ton and half of our car turning into the road, so a flashing light is not that important?  I suppose I could argue that a child on the pavement might just react to the flashing light as we rounded the corner, so it is still beneficial.

Another situation would be with a real pupil - if you had one that was really quite competent, could you transfer responsibility for deciding to signal?

I think the simple answer is as intimated, signalling is expected for major to minor on test, but I've got some time on my hands so I'm over-thinking some of this stuff. smile

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#8 27-07-12 22:35:25

Dalek Sec
Verified Member
Registered: 07-10-09
Posts: 1,187

Re: Signalling for approaching junctions question

I am NOT a fan of signalling to move off and stop regardless - That for me is lazy as no thought is going into the decision to signal.

As for junctions, I can think of few junctions where you can see sufficiently to assess whether a signal is needed or not.  At junctions things can change and a last minute "oops I should signal" is not helpful.

People not signalling at roundabouts is a major problem!

I find Police are often good at not signalling when we clearly could benefit from a signal!!

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