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#1 28-03-12 15:20:12

Driver99
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Registered: 21-01-11
Posts: 264

Part 3 - PST3 TIR question

During the TIR, if someone has been waiting for your car to complete the various phases, is it acceptable to wave them on (either in front or behind you) before you complete the manoeuvre (road clear etc.)?

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28-03-12 15:20:12

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Re: Part 3 - PST3 TIR question



#2 28-03-12 15:49:53

Cliff
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Registered: 20-12-11
Posts: 44

Re: Part 3 - PST3 TIR question

Yes in fact if it a new learner who may take some time to complete then I think you should check it is clear and wave them through if the learner is able to complete in a timely manner then I would teach to check at each phase and continue if safe. That is not likely on a part 3 as it is a partly trained exersise.

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#3 28-03-12 19:54:03

Cliff
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Registered: 20-12-11
Posts: 44

Re: Part 3 - PST3 TIR question

I was not only refering to Part 3 but what will happen in everyday life perhaps I should have made that a little clearer. On part three this will be a new exersise for the learner so you would be using full guided instruction at least for the first couple of attempts but remember the learner already has most of the core skills needed to carry out the manouvre. POM and at least some clutch control if emerging has been covered at closed junctions and stopping the car it is just a matter of further development of these skills in a different situation. I would take the responsibility of dealing with approaching traffic, at first but explain that as he becomes more fluent I will pass that over to him.

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#4 28-03-12 21:32:03

kaf
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From: Wiltshire
Registered: 05-08-07
Posts: 3,328
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Re: Part 3 - PST3 TIR question

The OP was clearly asking from a PST point of view, what would the instructor do. As an ADI I might on very rare occasions wave another driver through.

However, in a real learner situation I do not and never would allow a pupil to beckon another driver on. Stop and make eye contact, wait by all means, but the decision should always be left to the waiting driver.

IMHO Waving another through is not something learners should be encouraged to do.

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#5 29-03-12 05:22:36

Cliff
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Registered: 20-12-11
Posts: 44

Re: Part 3 - PST3 TIR question

All are entitled to their opinion I don't have a problem with it if done correctly.

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#6 29-03-12 11:54:06

(ROG)
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From: LEICESTER
Registered: 23-08-10
Posts: 1,551

Re: Part 3 - PST3 TIR question

I saw an ADI do this in a way I thought was clever and safe

The pupil was obviously struggling with a turn in the road so I saw the ADI instruct the pupil to apply the handbrake and then say something to them - I assume it was not to do anything
The ADI then opened the door and leaned out to beckon us on - there was a few vehicles waiting by then.


IAM Observer
Leicester group of advanced motorists
LGV instructor from 2005 to 2008

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#7 29-03-12 12:06:01

Driver99
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Registered: 21-01-11
Posts: 264

Re: Part 3 - PST3 TIR question

So as a PDI supervising the Examiner/pupil, it would be OK to say something like "this nice person's been waiting for us for a bit; while we're here with the handbrake on and in neutral, I can see it's safe, so I'm just going to give them the opportunity to move past.  Normally, as a driver, you wouldn't need to do this, but at this stage of your training, as you're being a bit slower than you will be able to do this, it's just helping out that other road user."

I would think the chances of needing to do it are slim, but if the DE was acting up and stalled a couple of times, it would be nice to know that it wouldn't be an instant fail if I considered the other road users.

I've seen a Part 3 training video where the PDI does this (the waving on, not the chat) and I was thinking what's the difference between that and waving a pedestrian on at a crossing, which apparently gets you sent straight to Hell!

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#8 29-03-12 12:51:21

Cliff
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Registered: 20-12-11
Posts: 44

Re: Part 3 - PST3 TIR question

Hi Driver99

Yes I believe what you outline above is a safe , sensible and acceptable approach.

in regard to the examiner "acting up" that will largely depend how much control you keep over him. I have sat in on many Part Three tests and a recurring problem is trying to rush to get it done, sometimes due to the pressure of waiting traffic, which is why I advocate calling traffic past something that was suggested to the candidate after the test by the SE who said he could feel the pressure from the PDI'.

Make sure each stage is correct before you move to the next, for example is the level of biting point correct, not too little not to much if you let him get too much he will be down thr road before you can say " clutch down a bit" They are very good at that sort of thing, but keep him kindly but firmly under control and you should find it much easier than you might think.

Clifff

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#9 29-03-12 13:19:59

Driver99
Member
Registered: 21-01-11
Posts: 264

Re: Part 3 - PST3 TIR question

Cliff wrote:

Hi Driver99

Yes I believe what you outline above is a safe , sensible and acceptable approach.

in regard to the examiner "acting up" that will largely depend how much control you keep over him. I have sat in on many Part Three tests and a recurring problem is trying to rush to get it done, sometimes due to the pressure of waiting traffic, which is why I advocate calling traffic past something that was suggested to the candidate after the test by the SE who said he could feel the pressure from the PDI'.

Make sure each stage is correct before you move to the next, for example is the level of biting point correct, not too little not to much if you let him get too much he will be down thr road before you can say " clutch down a bit" They are very good at that sort of thing, but keep him kindly but firmly under control and you should find it much easier than you might think.

Clifff

Thanks for that.  I thought as soon as I wrote about stalling, the comments would be I should be keeping control!  I'm coming at this with a background as an IAM Observer, and the level of control over there is somewhat different!

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#10 29-03-12 13:22:46

Driver99
Member
Registered: 21-01-11
Posts: 264

Re: Part 3 - PST3 TIR question

Danny Steel wrote:

Sounds good to me  smile

Cheers!

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#11 13-04-12 08:17:23

marconi1
Verified Member
From: Dawlish
Registered: 25-02-04
Posts: 693
Website

Re: Part 3 - PST3 TIR question

And yet the highway code tells us 'never to beckon on another vehicle'

In my opinion though IF the pupil or role playing examiner was to appear to struggle then after making sure it was safe and telling my pupil/role playing examiner what I was doing I may not beckon but tell them I was directing the traffic. Now beware as on a part three the examiner will probably be looking for guidance on this aspect and will expect you to teach him/her what to do. On a lesson the pupil may be struggling with the task demands and as we are all familiar with 'Maslow's order of hierarchy' we would not want to take the pupil out of their comfort zone.

Speak soon


Dave Foster MA, Dip.DI
F.inst.D.E.R, M.Inst.MTD, M.A.I.R.O, A.I.F.L,
Foster the Joy of Driving
http://dte-elite.co.uk  http://drivertrainingeducation.co.uk

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