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#26 09-11-08 22:23:20

Stephen7738
Member
From: Warrington
Registered: 12-10-04
Posts: 305

Re: Why does IAM seem more popular than RoSPA?

Your right Lynne it is 4yrs since this post and If I remember rightly you were only 2yrs into your ADI career which means now that you will be an old hand or should i say an experienced old hand at it :evil:I think you are right lets put this thread to bed once and for all.
Stephen

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09-11-08 22:23:20

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Re: Why does IAM seem more popular than RoSPA?




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#27 10-11-08 06:31:56

ExAdiNigel
Member
From: Plymouth, Devon
Registered: 13-12-04
Posts: 4,739

Re: Why does IAM seem more popular than RoSPA?

I like IAM as ROSPA do power thusts and double declutching.  You don't know them in cars with the gearboxs we have.

I think you will find there are some that like double de-clutching and these drivers aren't restricted to RoSPA, there will be some IAM members who prefer it too.  The syllabus followed by both, IAM and RoSPA, is Roadcraft and as such is pretty much the same!  Double de-clutching isn't necessary with modern gearboxes, but there isn't much wrong with it.

What are power thrusts?  I have passed the IAM test and the RoSPA test and have never heard of them.

Nigel


National Standards Cycling Instructor, Ex Adi

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#28 10-11-08 07:52:46

Gizmotime
Administrator
From: Bolton Lancashire
Registered: 05-04-04
Posts: 1,962

Re: Why does IAM seem more popular than RoSPA?

What are power thrusts?  I have passed the IAM test and the RoSPA test and have never heard of them.

Nigel

Well I have been an Observer for near on 8 years with the IAM, and also have no idea what is meant by "power thrusts" would love to know so I can comment on it more.

Giz

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#29 10-11-08 08:33:08

tony adi
Verified Member
From: Selby
Registered: 12-05-08
Posts: 1,233
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Re: Why does IAM seem more popular than RoSPA?

What are power thrusts?

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=qwofLIBOogs  big_smile big_smile big_smile

In a driving context, gearing down at high revs or red lining are two of the methods I've heard of described in a similar way.


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#30 10-11-08 09:34:10

ExAdiNigel
Member
From: Plymouth, Devon
Registered: 13-12-04
Posts: 4,739

Re: Why does IAM seem more popular than RoSPA?

Neither IAM or RoSPA would recommend red lining, because you are beyond the max power output from the engine so there would be no advantage.  Chris Gilbert talked about 90% of the revs available below the red line as being about eh optimum oputput at a recent talk to both IAM and RoSPA trainers.  This approximate and there are likely to be differences between petrol & diesel engines!

The other, are we, perhaps, referring to sustained rev gear changes?  If so, there is nothing wrong with that.

Nigel


National Standards Cycling Instructor, Ex Adi

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#31 10-11-08 10:08:49

tony adi
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From: Selby
Registered: 12-05-08
Posts: 1,233
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Re: Why does IAM seem more popular than RoSPA?

Just offering a couple of possibilities in answer to your question Nigel. There are several others, unless the OP enlightens us as to his interpretation we're just speculating.

Some of these IAM and RoSPA trainers do come out with weird and wonderful ideas sometimes.


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#32 10-11-08 16:09:55

billrhoades
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From: Northampton
Registered: 28-11-07
Posts: 184

Re: Why does IAM seem more popular than RoSPA?

RoSPA is ideal as CDP as you are retested. Never done IAM as I believe like many others on here that your driving skills continually change and it is only good professional practice to make sure your driving is at the highest possible standard.
As for costs between the two, someone stated that IAM is £80 , RoSPA including the test is roughly the same, group joining fee £10, Roadcraft £14.99, test fee at this moment in time £45. You can also join RoSPA for £20 annually which entitles you to free retest and monthly newspaper.

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#33 10-11-08 16:50:16

David1108
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Registered: 09-11-08
Posts: 27

Re: Why does IAM seem more popular than RoSPA?

If anyone has got the Roadcraft video it shows the police dong the following.

Left foot down on the clutch, moves the gear into 2nd, pushes the gas down to rev the engine and lets the clutch up.  Not needed by us as we don't need the power the police do as I can slow down and go into 3rd gear or 2nd gear and then take the band. 

Now Double de-clutching is when you change gear and I think it goes like this.  You take your right foot off the gas and put the clutch down, take the gear out, then rev the engine then put the clutch back in and then put the gear back in again.  I think it works something like that. 

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#34 10-11-08 16:56:29

VandADI
Administrator
From: Coulsdon, Surrey
Registered: 29-02-04
Posts: 7,592

Re: Why does IAM seem more popular than RoSPA?

David, if you read this thread : http://www.drivertrainingtoday.co.uk/fo … 081.0.html
you will find out about double declutching.

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#35 10-11-08 17:29:19

ExAdiNigel
Member
From: Plymouth, Devon
Registered: 13-12-04
Posts: 4,739

Re: Why does IAM seem more popular than RoSPA?

If anyone has got the Roadcraft video it shows the police dong the following.

Left foot down on the clutch, moves the gear into 2nd, pushes the gas down to rev the engine and lets the clutch up.  Not needed by us as we don't need the power the police do as I can slow down and go into 3rd gear or 2nd gear and then take the band.....

Sounds like sustained gear change then.  I would suggest that using this method is more about reducing clutch wear than producing power. 

Give it a go.

Nigel


National Standards Cycling Instructor, Ex Adi

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#36 10-11-08 17:40:53

David1108
Member
Registered: 09-11-08
Posts: 27

Re: Why does IAM seem more popular than RoSPA?

Now that is a good bit of reading and I don't use double declutching as I have a 1998 Ford car.  Why would I need to learn it when I can slow down and change gear when the speed is right for the gear.  IAM don't use it and I know that about 10 to 15 years Rospa did.  If Rospa does not now use this double declutch then that's good.  But I not going to learn it.

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#37 10-11-08 17:43:40

ExAdiNigel
Member
From: Plymouth, Devon
Registered: 13-12-04
Posts: 4,739

Re: Why does IAM seem more popular than RoSPA?

Who's suggesting you should learn double de-clutching?

Sustained rev gear change, now that's a different matter.  As I have suggested that will reduce clutch wear, isn't outdated, is relevant to modern cars and I would teach it o to an associate from the IAM or RoSPA.

Nigel


National Standards Cycling Instructor, Ex Adi

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#38 10-11-08 17:56:18

David1108
Member
Registered: 09-11-08
Posts: 27

Re: Why does IAM seem more popular than RoSPA?

The IAM don't teach it and if I'm going to be a observer with them I can't teach what the IAM don't want.  Plus ADIs can't teach outside of the DSA area as the DSA don't teach Advanced driving to learneds.  But just to put them into the good books if ADIs now how to drive as an Advanced driver then they can teach it to full licence holder.  So I am happy with the IAM and you are happy with what you are doing and in the group you are in.

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#39 10-11-08 18:08:29

VandADI
Administrator
From: Coulsdon, Surrey
Registered: 29-02-04
Posts: 7,592

Re: Why does IAM seem more popular than RoSPA?

No one has said that the IAM advocate double declutching, infact you brought the subject up first not sure of what it was.
As for DSA teaching advanced driving to learners, no they don't, why teach someone to run before they can walk? Besides its not the DSA that teach learners, is it? However, pass plus which is about advanced driving is part of the DSA syllabus.
Infact ADIs that are IAM qualified can become IAM registered driving instructors which means we get paid to teach the syllabus according to IAM standards.  That is just one of many advanced driving tests a newly qualified driver can take, its all horses for courses really!

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#40 10-11-08 18:23:08

David1108
Member
Registered: 09-11-08
Posts: 27

Re: Why does IAM seem more popular than RoSPA?

Well that's good to know that ADIs do teach the IAM system and it works.  But they won't of course teach them to cut the roadabout if its safe as the DSA would not allow it.  But I am happy to hear that the ADI's can use it and I do hope that there pupils pass there tests.  I know I passed first time. 

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#41 10-11-08 18:29:52

VandADI
Administrator
From: Coulsdon, Surrey
Registered: 29-02-04
Posts: 7,592

Re: Why does IAM seem more popular than RoSPA?

David, there are many styles of driving, as you will no doubt find out when investigating them all.  We are all entitled to our own opinion of what we think is the best type for the individual when we have had the experience.  Some people feel quite strongly one way, or the other about the differences, but this is only after they have had experiences that each test entails.

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#42 10-11-08 18:50:34

David1108
Member
Registered: 09-11-08
Posts: 27

Re: Why does IAM seem more popular than RoSPA?

Well if I do want to learn more lated I well but I like first to start with the observer training then maybe I will learn some more but for now I'm busy on observer training.

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#43 10-11-08 18:55:21

jonnmedds
Verified Member
From: Staffordshire
Registered: 25-02-04
Posts: 154

Re: Why does IAM seem more popular than RoSPA?

Without being disrespectful David you sound like a person who feels that he has become the perfect driver.

My opinion is that an Advanced/Defensive driver is somebody who is continually striving to improve their own driving and is willing to learn and listen. There are always drivers on the road who are better than us.

Jon

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#44 10-11-08 19:04:07

David1108
Member
Registered: 09-11-08
Posts: 27

Re: Why does IAM seem more popular than RoSPA?

I am on my observer training and when I done that I may then go and learn some more but until then I can't do two courses at the some time.  I go round the band as I can't do more then one.  So I do my observer training first. 

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#45 10-11-08 19:18:13

jonnmedds
Verified Member
From: Staffordshire
Registered: 25-02-04
Posts: 154

Re: Why does IAM seem more popular than RoSPA?

Who say's you need to go on a course to improve your driving.

Improving your driving is a continual process. Every day I feel that I learn more whilst out on the road.

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#46 10-11-08 19:30:25

timmanwaringadi
Verified Member
From: Devon
Registered: 29-08-06
Posts: 2,406
Website

Re: Why does IAM seem more popular than RoSPA?

I can't do two courses at the some time.

I'm currently doing several courses at the same time, multi-tasking is what driving is all about.

(Quad bike instructor's course, Trailer Handling course, Winching and recovery instructor's course, also studying towards Dip DI, ORDIT, and researching the a2om NVQ, Hagglunds training, the cat H test, vehicle dependent expeditions, change management, NLP, H&S law, Management training, CSS, employment law, while constantly striving to improve my driving, off-road techniques, quad riding (working on manual quads with lever clutches at the moment), website SEO and my presentation skills)

(am I stretching myself too thin?.......Nah!)

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#47 10-11-08 20:02:29

jonnmedds
Verified Member
From: Staffordshire
Registered: 25-02-04
Posts: 154

Re: Why does IAM seem more popular than RoSPA?

Can I have two of whatever Tim is taking  big_smile

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#48 10-11-08 20:04:37

timmanwaringadi
Verified Member
From: Devon
Registered: 29-08-06
Posts: 2,406
Website

Re: Why does IAM seem more popular than RoSPA?

I'm just trying to catch up jon!

Some of you already have a bit of a head start on me.

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#49 10-11-08 20:26:47

tony adi
Verified Member
From: Selby
Registered: 12-05-08
Posts: 1,233
Website

Re: Why does IAM seem more popular than RoSPA?

The IAM don't teach it and if I'm going to be a observer with them I can't teach what the IAM don't want.  Plus ADIs can't teach outside of the DSA area as the DSA don't teach Advanced driving to learneds.  But just to put them into the good books if ADIs now how to drive as an Advanced driver then they can teach it to full licence holder.  So I am happy with the IAM and you are happy with what you are doing and in the group you are in.

Good ADI's teach people to drive. Many have taken IAM's RoSPA and a whole host of other tests you have probably never heard of. They also know which parts of each standard of driving are suitable to be taught to different standards of drivers, and which parts are downright dangerous if taught incorrectly, or to drivers who have neither the experience or skills to know when and if to implement them. Good ADI's neither use nor disregard anything just because some organisation says so, whether that be DSA or IAMs or anybody else. There is a hell of a lot more to good driving than anything contained in any of the various "styles".


www.selbydriving.co.uk

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“Criticism may not be agreeable, but it is necessary. It fulfills the same
function as pain in the human body. It calls attention to an unhealthy
state of things.”
~ Winston Churchill

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#50 11-11-08 10:41:58

billrhoades
Verified Member
From: Northampton
Registered: 28-11-07
Posts: 184

Re: Why does IAM seem more popular than RoSPA?

I teach advanced/defensive driving techniques to my novice drivers.Why wait until they develop bad habits before teaching them? All forms of driving carry defensive driving methods whether the DSA like it or not. I start by asking novice drivers if they want to learn msm-psl-lad or IPSGA. Brokendown into individual segments they are the same!!!

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