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#26 22-10-07 21:53:24

EKAL
Verified Member
From: East Kilbride
Registered: 23-04-06
Posts: 1,050
Website

Re: SAFED for Vans starts again

anyone know what a SAFED course actually entails?
what is the sylabus?

is it anything like "advanced/fleet" training?


DSA ADI, DSA Fleet, RoADAR Diploma, RoADAR Gold.
SAFED for LGV/HGV - SAFED train the trainer
Driver CPC Trainer
www.agnewdrivertraining.co.uk

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22-10-07 21:53:24

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Re: SAFED for Vans starts again




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#27 23-10-07 05:48:25

ExAdiNigel
Member
From: Plymouth, Devon
Registered: 13-12-04
Posts: 4,739

Re: SAFED for Vans starts again

anyone know what a SAFED course actually entails?
what is the sylabus?

is it anything like "advanced/fleet" training?

Don't know for sure cos I haven't been on the course yet, but the name Safe And Fuel Efficient Driving suggests that there is a lot of emphasis on Eco-Driving.  Could be one of those things where we could be told but we would have to be shot after though! big_smile

Nigel


National Standards Cycling Instructor, Ex Adi

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#28 23-10-07 08:04:44

timmanwaringadi
Verified Member
From: Devon
Registered: 29-08-06
Posts: 2,406
Website

Re: SAFED for Vans starts again

I must've got lucky too - doing mine with another Lancaster ADI on 31st and 1st.

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#29 23-10-07 09:38:21

bigred
Verified Member
From: Kent
Registered: 25-02-04
Posts: 1,592
Website

Re: SAFED for Vans starts again

The 2 day trainers course is a bit of a jolly and could probably be done in one day rather than two. neutral

The SAFED course delivered to van drivers is basically a laptop presentation for about an hour; licence, eyesight and vehicle checks; a first assessment drive; a demonstration drive; a coaching session; a second assessment drive and a theory test.

If you have 2 drivers, which is the norm, then you will end up visiting a petrol station umpteen times during the day to top up the fuel to the brim, it gets some very strange looks and comments from the cashiers. By recording fuel, gear usage, time of drive, faults committed etc on each assessment you can see the actual improvement through the day for each driver.

Now SAFED have proved the training works, I would personnally like to see a greater element of training and coaching rather than quite so much assessment. But I'm told that's not going to happen.

Anyway, it's definitely a useful course for any van driver.

Regards,

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#30 23-10-07 11:45:30

timmanwaringadi
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From: Devon
Registered: 29-08-06
Posts: 2,406
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#31 23-10-07 17:23:57

EKAL
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From: East Kilbride
Registered: 23-04-06
Posts: 1,050
Website

Re: SAFED for Vans starts again

it sounds/looks to me as if there is going to be a bit of overkill with all the different types of training for drivers going about..............

Advanced
ECO
SAFED
Fleet
Pass Plus

I realise some are private related and some professional, but surely they could be combined to reflect all in one package, and that pack "could" be Pass Plus.
If Pass Plus was extended to maybe 10 hours to include some advanced driving, Eco and safed then that would help slightly?
and i think that if PP was extended to include the above, it might get more recognition from the insurance companies....................................." I wish" :evil:


DSA ADI, DSA Fleet, RoADAR Diploma, RoADAR Gold.
SAFED for LGV/HGV - SAFED train the trainer
Driver CPC Trainer
www.agnewdrivertraining.co.uk

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#32 24-10-07 08:49:11

timmanwaringadi
Verified Member
From: Devon
Registered: 29-08-06
Posts: 2,406
Website

Re: SAFED for Vans starts again

There's a lot of different types of drivers around ekal. Car, Van, Goods etc. There's also lots of different types of driver around, confident, nervous, high risk, those with a lack of vehicle and fuel sympathy.

I agree with you that pass plus isn't currently working, and needs to be changed in order that those who pass it become better drivers and therefore lower risk for insurance companies - but that is going to take a lot more work than 6 or even 10 hours.

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#33 24-10-07 08:53:20

bigred
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From: Kent
Registered: 25-02-04
Posts: 1,592
Website

Re: SAFED for Vans starts again

I'm not sure a one size fits all would ever work.

There are elements in all driver training programmes that are the same and can't be removed.

Pass Plus is really only suitable for novice drivers (in fact haven't we covered most of it in detail pre test neutral)

Insurance companies do recognise lots of different training programmes. You can negotiate discounts on many fleet policies simply by asking "what discount will you give if our drivers receive extra training?"

As a fleet company we have to sell what the customer wants, something that ticks all their boxes and tickles their fancy. But in the end it doesn't matter what it's wrapped up in as all drivers get taught good principles of safe and efficient driving.

Regards,

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#34 24-10-07 14:43:39

hector
Verified Member
From: Manchester
Registered: 04-04-06
Posts: 2,097
Website

Re: SAFED for Vans starts again

Lets be honest Big red

These van drivers dont give two hoots about fuel economy. Ive done over 50 drivers on Safed now and most go through the motions, no more no less and return to their old style straight afterwards.Asking them to drive back after completion of the course is a real eye opener when they relax and show their real drive!

Fuel economy for the company only to persuade them, in the main you cant teach old dogs new tricks about road saftey but if ive got through to one im happy. I concentrate on safety every course.

The Safed way of checking economy is so unreliable to the point of being a waste of time really, it really needs to be more scientific.

Dont suppose there is really any other way of doing it though without throwing some real money at it.

Safed is designed to sell to companies as they have little interest in road safety other than fullfilling the HSE obligations, so fair enough with the course emphasis.

Anyway Tim and Nigel they must be desperate if you two are starting on it  big_smile big_smile big_smile.

make sure you pass the opening theory exam or your out before you start wink


EXCELSIOR TRAINING 
James Dawson Grade 6 ADI (Ordit Registered) Ba (Hons) Driver Education
ADI qualification/Check test training/Excelsior DSA Ordit/fleet courses
Johnny boy United 20 its coming son

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#35 24-10-07 14:47:51

timmanwaringadi
Verified Member
From: Devon
Registered: 29-08-06
Posts: 2,406
Website

Re: SAFED for Vans starts again

Theory exam? D'oh!

What do I need to 'remind' myself of?

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#36 24-10-07 15:42:52

bigred
Verified Member
From: Kent
Registered: 25-02-04
Posts: 1,592
Website

Re: SAFED for Vans starts again

Stuff to do with vans big_smile

Speed limits etc.

Have fun

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#37 28-10-07 18:03:15

helee
Verified Member
Registered: 12-11-06
Posts: 182

Re: SAFED for Vans starts again

Lucky you i never got accepted sad

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#38 28-10-07 22:22:36

ExAdiNigel
Member
From: Plymouth, Devon
Registered: 13-12-04
Posts: 4,739

Re: SAFED for Vans starts again

There has certainly been no warning of a theory test before we start, just that we should complete the course with 'excellence'

Nigel


National Standards Cycling Instructor, Ex Adi

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#39 29-10-07 07:04:19

hector
Verified Member
From: Manchester
Registered: 04-04-06
Posts: 2,097
Website

Re: SAFED for Vans starts again

Its just a basic test

20 questions if i remember right, pass rate 15 i think. Trainer made a point of saying pass was needed or course was over.
The excellent grade is required to undertake courses under your own company name. Course is fairly straightforward pm for any details.


EXCELSIOR TRAINING 
James Dawson Grade 6 ADI (Ordit Registered) Ba (Hons) Driver Education
ADI qualification/Check test training/Excelsior DSA Ordit/fleet courses
Johnny boy United 20 its coming son

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#40 29-10-07 07:06:37

whodareswins
Verified Member
From: S.E.England
Registered: 12-04-06
Posts: 550

Re: SAFED for Vans starts again

There has certainly been no warning of a theory test before we start, just that we should complete the course with 'excellence'

Nigel

The (trainer) training you receive (from Drivetech) basically reflects the training you will subsequently provide to your customers. One of the elements of this customer training is a 20 question theory test and a pass is one of the requirements for a driver to receive an "excellent" rating. The theory test that you will be asked to do is exactly the same as that given to your future customers and is very basic.

Percy


Grade 6 ADI/Fleet Trainer, SAFED Registered Trainer, Qualified BTEC Assessor

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#41 29-10-07 09:28:44

bigred
Verified Member
From: Kent
Registered: 25-02-04
Posts: 1,592
Website

Re: SAFED for Vans starts again

That's about right for the training except it's not all given by Drivetech - there are several companies that have been accreddited with being able to train the trainer.

Regards,

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#42 29-10-07 10:53:49

timmanwaringadi
Verified Member
From: Devon
Registered: 29-08-06
Posts: 2,406
Website

Re: SAFED for Vans starts again

Nigel - I've seen the quiz - nothing to worry about, I reckon you're probably slightly better on the theory stuff than I am (you always seem knowledgable), and none of them phased me.

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#43 29-10-07 13:41:27

ExAdiNigel
Member
From: Plymouth, Devon
Registered: 13-12-04
Posts: 4,739

Re: SAFED for Vans starts again

Nigel - I've seen the quiz - nothing to worry about, I reckon you're probably slightly better on the theory stuff than I am (you always seem knowledgable), and none of them phased me.

I don't feel too worried, but it does seem the wrong way round.  If they want you to sit a test BEFORE the training it should be done a couple of weeks before the training days are scheduled.  If the test is at the time of the training it should be at the end of the course to confirm the correct learning has taken place!  Typical government getting things arse about face?

Nigel


National Standards Cycling Instructor, Ex Adi

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#44 29-10-07 14:14:55

timmanwaringadi
Verified Member
From: Devon
Registered: 29-08-06
Posts: 2,406
Website

Re: SAFED for Vans starts again

I agree with that one, but it's presumably because the DSA route for just about everything is to check your knowledge, check your skills, then help you pass them on.

I presume that if you got the questions wrong you'd be given help to get them right, and a chance to redeem yourself - if not that would be incredibly stupid.

I have to admit though, I'm doing another trainer training course at the moment - I've had loads of training, then a knowledge test to verify that I've taken everything in, and THEN they teach you to train others.

As we know these things go around in circles - the next course you go on will start the circle again - knowledge, skills, teach, new knowledge, new skills, new teaching etc - I suppose it just depends what you're doing as to which point they do the test - it seems to come before the teaching bit (let's check he can do this before we get him teaching it!).

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#45 29-10-07 16:48:02

whodareswins
Verified Member
From: S.E.England
Registered: 12-04-06
Posts: 550

Re: SAFED for Vans starts again

I don't feel too worried, but it does seem the wrong way round.  If they want you to sit a test BEFORE the training it should be done a couple of weeks before the training days are scheduled.  If the test is at the time of the training it should be at the end of the course to confirm the correct learning has taken place!  Typical government getting things arse about face?

Nigel

Come on Nigel. The test is exactly the same one as your "white van man" trainees will be given. Is it not reasonable that you should have (at least) the same level of knowledge?  The training you receive is about how to deliver the SAFED training. Any Fleet Trainer should be able to walk through the theory test with their eyes closed.

Percy


Grade 6 ADI/Fleet Trainer, SAFED Registered Trainer, Qualified BTEC Assessor

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#46 31-10-07 19:25:52

EKAL
Verified Member
From: East Kilbride
Registered: 23-04-06
Posts: 1,050
Website

Re: SAFED for Vans starts again

I asked my work if they would pay for me to be trained on the SAFED course, turns out its a 2 day course @ £200 per day, and as I am an ADI I can carryout training of others commercially if I want, the other assessor in my work is not ADI so he can only carryout in-house training.
My work have asked me to put together a presentation of the benefits of this training and how much we "might" save per year.
Anyone got any ideas I could add into it, I have put together an 11 page Powerpoint presentation for now using mainly quotes and info from the safed web site, has anyone else got any personal experiences of safed training I could use?

P.S - anyone know how you go about being a Senior Instructor(safed)?


DSA ADI, DSA Fleet, RoADAR Diploma, RoADAR Gold.
SAFED for LGV/HGV - SAFED train the trainer
Driver CPC Trainer
www.agnewdrivertraining.co.uk

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#47 31-10-07 20:56:35

helee
Verified Member
Registered: 12-11-06
Posts: 182

Re: SAFED for Vans starts again

so can you train and get the safed qualification for £400 and then go on and sell and do safed courses??

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#48 31-10-07 22:26:36

hector
Verified Member
From: Manchester
Registered: 04-04-06
Posts: 2,097
Website

Re: SAFED for Vans starts again

No

Safed training course is £100 + vat, if accepted currently - Dont know where the 200 per day comes from??

This fee is refunded anyway. The course was available when the funding last finished and subsidy had stopped, but no one was interested then!

Lee i used your laptop in Coffee tempo if you remember hence the access!


EXCELSIOR TRAINING 
James Dawson Grade 6 ADI (Ordit Registered) Ba (Hons) Driver Education
ADI qualification/Check test training/Excelsior DSA Ordit/fleet courses
Johnny boy United 20 its coming son

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#49 31-10-07 22:37:32

ExAdiNigel
Member
From: Plymouth, Devon
Registered: 13-12-04
Posts: 4,739

Re: SAFED for Vans starts again

No

Safed training course is £100 + vat, if accepted currently - Dont know where the 200 per day comes from??

This fee is refunded anyway. The course was available when the funding last finished and subsidy had stopped, but no one was interested then!

Lee i used your laptop in Coffee tempo if you remember hence the access!

The training, as Hector says, is £100 + VAT.

Just read the booking form from the company that is providing training me and they are getting £375 per day to give the training.  Where do you get £200 per day from?

Nigel


National Standards Cycling Instructor, Ex Adi

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#50 01-11-07 16:36:08

EKAL
Verified Member
From: East Kilbride
Registered: 23-04-06
Posts: 1,050
Website

Re: SAFED for Vans starts again

I called one of the Senior Instructors on the safed website (http://www.safed.org.uk/SAFED%20Scotland/CentralandTay.htm ) and he told me that he could carryout the training for £200 per day for 1 person (£300 if HE supplied the vehicle) and that I would be classed as a Trainer, but if my work colleague went on course(non ADI) he would only be in-house.

where does the £100 + vat come from? is this if you are trying for the course yourself? I am looking for my fulltime employer to foot the bill, so that I can then train my fellow drivers......

Have I [picked all this up wrong? hope not, I have a presentation on monday to back up my claim that this can save the company money.

P.S - how do I go about getting the refund, or should I really bother considering my company might be footing the bill  roll?

AL


DSA ADI, DSA Fleet, RoADAR Diploma, RoADAR Gold.
SAFED for LGV/HGV - SAFED train the trainer
Driver CPC Trainer
www.agnewdrivertraining.co.uk

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