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#26 08-07-07 04:54:21

ExAdiNigel
Member
From: Plymouth, Devon
Registered: 13-12-04
Posts: 4,739

Re: Use of the Horn

If you stand on the brakes in a PCV you are going to injure your passengers. If a car pulls out in front of you then brake progressively and sound the horn to alert the other vehicle.

First priority is care of your own passengers, second priority is avoiding injury to the other road user.

If you have to wipe out the other vehicle then so be it.

and the point of sounding the horn once a car has pulled out in front of you is?


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08-07-07 04:54:21

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Re: Use of the Horn



#27 08-07-07 06:09:13

AndyBerry
Guest

Re: Use of the Horn

that isn't what we have been saying - we are discussing using it as a preventative method to reduce the number of occurances of this happening...


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#28 08-07-07 07:30:06

ExAdiNigel
Member
From: Plymouth, Devon
Registered: 13-12-04
Posts: 4,739

Re: Use of the Horn

....If a car pulls out in front of you then brake progressively and sound the horn to alert the other vehicle.
....

I was responding to the above quote Andy.  Sounding the horn AFTER he has pulled out in front of you is not correct use of the horn and isn't going to be much use!

Nigel


National Standards Cycling Instructor, Ex Adi

Offline


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#29 08-07-07 09:06:20

reddragonbus
Verified Member
From: Edinburgh
Registered: 05-02-06
Posts: 1,653

Re: Use of the Horn

reddragonbus wrote:

If you stand on the brakes in a PCV you are going to injure your passengers. If a car pulls out in front of you then brake progressively and sound the horn to alert the other vehicle.

First priority is care of your own passengers, second priority is avoiding injury to the other road user.

If you have to wipe out the other vehicle then so be it.

and the point of sounding the horn once a car has pulled out in front of you is?

Simply to alert the other driver that you are there and about to hit them.


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#30 08-07-07 09:17:30

reddragonbus
Verified Member
From: Edinburgh
Registered: 05-02-06
Posts: 1,653

Re: Use of the Horn

It's amazing that some drivers are completely oblivious!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDTLo-nDsUQ


LGV PCV Instructor DVSA ADI Fleet

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#31 08-07-07 09:19:32

Dimmy
Guest

Re: Use of the Horn

Simply to alert the other driver that you are there.

Dimmy edit.  <weg> :evil:


3 pages on horn use/abuse. Glad this isn't a question in the DSA's Learners' question bank.

Oh Silly Dimmy, it IS.

I'll happily toot the horn on a tight blind bend or corner, on approach to a blind humped bridge, when a vehicle is reversing towards me and I believe the driver is not aware of my position, when a vehicle is rolling back towards me and I believe the driver is not aware of their motion, or anywhere  visibility is very poor and I anticipate other road users not being able to see me approach.

Use of the horn is not an excuse for poor planning or speed assesment on my part but an aide to assist other road users.

In regards to 5mph being too slow.  If the conditions dictate, then 5mph is the correct speed, wether I've got a line of traffic behind me or not, and I wouldn't be prepared to rely on my sounding of the horn just so I might drive at 10 or 15mph because I feel pressured from following traffic.


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#32 08-07-07 09:24:41

Dimmy
Guest

Re: Use of the Horn

It's amazing that some drivers are completely oblivious!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDTLo-nDsUQ

I agree the car driver pulled out dangerously but the bus only loses control after wildly flashing his lights, the car driver panics and immediately pulls over to the side of the road and the bus driver takes excessive avoiding action.

So the car driver shows poor awareness but the bus driver is almost wholly at fault at the resulting incident.

#33 08-07-07 09:28:54

AndyBerry
Guest

Re: Use of the Horn

Unfortunately we can't see much of what happens - but if the wheels were locked on what appears to be a rather wet road, then the resulting action may well of been unavoidable... but this isn't the point, the incident still occured because of the car pulling out in front of a coach.

What worries me, however, is the fact that it was filmed on a police video camera and it shows them make no effort to go to the incident or go after the offending car....

#34 08-07-07 09:32:46

reddragonbus
Verified Member
From: Edinburgh
Registered: 05-02-06
Posts: 1,653

Re: Use of the Horn

Dimmy, Have you have ever tried to stop a fully loaded bus going down hill at 50mph in the wet?


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#35 08-07-07 09:38:35

Dimmy
Guest

Re: Use of the Horn

Dimmy, Have you have ever tried to stop a fully loaded bus going down hill at 50mph in the wet?

No, the largest vehicles I've driven have beenn 7.5 tonnes.

I wonder if someone had asked the bus driver that same question before this incident. And if they had, would this incident have occurred?

I am NOT excusing the car driver in any way, but the bus was still under control UNTIL the bus driver showed his anger towards the car driver who then took stupid evasive action by pulling suddenly over towards the side of the road (possibly expecting bus to overtake).

Loss of control only appeared to occur AFTER the car pulled to the side of the carriageway and forcing the bus driver to brake excessively and steer violently.

#36 08-07-07 09:41:15

reddragonbus
Verified Member
From: Edinburgh
Registered: 05-02-06
Posts: 1,653

Re: Use of the Horn

I don't think the bus driver was showing anger, I think the bus driver was completely stunned.

The driver of the bus should have rammed the car out of the way.


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#37 08-07-07 09:43:11

Green Arrow
Verified Member
Registered: 01-04-07
Posts: 206

Re: Use of the Horn

Dimmy i have to go against you on this one  lol I didn't see much anger, i'm not sure if the bus driver did flash his lights? It looked like he was going over two bumps or something. I'm sure others can see if they can identify the bus driver flashing 'in aggression' towards the car. If i was the bus driver i would doing the same as well! (ok not that it would help but still) I wouldn't be best impressed at the actions of the plonker of a car driver  :x I just cannot put any of the blame on the poor bus driver but thats just my opinion.


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#38 08-07-07 19:51:28

ExAdiNigel
Member
From: Plymouth, Devon
Registered: 13-12-04
Posts: 4,739

Re: Use of the Horn

I don't think the bus driver was showing anger, I think the bus driver was completely stunned.

The driver of the bus should have rammed the car out of the way.

On this one Jonathan, I think I agree with you.  It would certainly have been a much less serious accident.

Nigel


National Standards Cycling Instructor, Ex Adi

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#39 09-07-07 10:44:48

AndyBerry
Guest

Re: Use of the Horn

Dimmy i have to go against you on this one  lol I didn't see much anger, i'm not sure if the bus driver did flash his lights? It looked like he was going over two bumps or something. I'm sure others can see if they can identify the bus driver flashing 'in aggression' towards the car. If i was the bus driver i would doing the same as well! (ok not that it would help but still) I wouldn't be best impressed at the actions of the plonker of a car driver  :x I just cannot put any of the blame on the poor bus driver but thats just my opinion.

Hayley - they were definitely the lights flashing, however if you do watch closely, there is an awful lot of spray suddenly gets kicked up on the left of the screen which I presume is probably from wheels locking up. However I think the sudden change in direction was simply caused by the car appearing to slow and steer into the side of the road - perhaps if they (the car) had continued to accelerate then things would of turned out a little differently

#40 09-07-07 18:35:34

Green Arrow
Verified Member
Registered: 01-04-07
Posts: 206

Re: Use of the Horn

Thanks Andy, I found the picture not too clear for me to tell. I also think there seemed to be some bodies coming out of the wondscreen on the bus as well  neutral  I thought it looked like it was icy or something but its just how it looks to me i think.


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#41 09-07-07 19:28:09

kev elliott
Guest

Re: Use of the Horn

Just watched the video full screen - about 8 seconds in just before the car pulls out bus lights flash as it goes over a bump in the road. I wonder if the car driver saw this flash then pulled out?

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