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#51 06-01-07 18:15:39

captainhook
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Registered: 12-06-06
Posts: 2,197
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Re: Should all trainers be a grade 6

Cheers for that tim i have my work cut out tonight. big_smile


For intensive driving courses or weekly lessons from a driving school using the latest Audi A3 - covering the Slough and surrounding areas - visit www.go-pass-driving-school.co.uk

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06-01-07 18:15:39

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Re: Should all trainers be a grade 6




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#52 06-01-07 18:16:52

timmanwaringadi
Verified Member
From: Devon
Registered: 29-08-06
Posts: 2,406
Website

Re: Should all trainers be a grade 6

Couple of bottles of beer and a highlighter pen - joy incarnate!

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#53 06-01-07 18:47:05

comedrivewithme
Verified Member
From: Treorchy, Rhondda, South Wales
Registered: 28-11-06
Posts: 674
Website

Re: Should all trainers be a grade 6

Around the time of my last failed part 3. I got 5 passes out of 6.  Not bad for someone who could not pass the test himself.  Got my grade 4 now. It's not a fantastic grade but I've just had 4 first time passes on the trott.  Must be doing something right.


Give yourself independenc, learn to drive!
www.Comedrivewithme.com
    Treorchy, Rhondda.

I see friends shaking hands, saying
"how do you do". 
They're really saying
"I love you" (Louie Armstrong)

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#54 06-01-07 19:48:39

hector
Verified Member
From: Manchester
Registered: 04-04-06
Posts: 2,097
Website

Re: Should all trainers be a grade 6

Hi all - Just to clarify a point The grade six is the least important of the credits to train others.

The qualifications are the most important by a mile, these qualifications show a broad range of knowledge that is crucial to have to be able to pass on.

There is no link whatsoever between a grade six instructor and a high pass rate!!
A trainee could easily have a better rate than the top grade instructor.
Pass rates are and always will be meaninmgless for the L test.
The ADI's who use one centre train on the routes and do bu gger all else will always have a high pass rate. The quality ADI teaching safe driving for life may well have a lower rate.

The only way to develop the necessary skills to be an ADI trainer (A real one!) is by study to gain the knowledge over years, prove that knowledge with the necessary passes in the relevant exams, gain experience in training and have the ability to pass that knowledge on.

The trouble is of course everybody needs a start and like your initial ADI first year or two the training you give will be poor, (You may well think its good at the time, Ive been there!) but experience is also crucial to develop the skills.

Some ADI's could develop these skills over a short period of time, others will never get there.

ASk yourself now any ADI out there were you happy with your training? The vast majority would say no and those that dont , dont realise what they have missed!

All down to profiteering by the larger companies, they cant use the highly qualified trainers cause they cant afford them!

Your trainer should have:

Dia Diploma
Ordit
Cardington or Rospa gold
Examiner experience
Fleet registered and accreditation
Teaching qualification

And no im not saying this cause i have them, im saying it because before i had them i was cr ap! And realise i was selling my clients short by not having the knowledge.

BUT again if i was anyone starting out i wouldnt hesitate to go for it and pick the quals up on the way, with the right attitude youll still be better than the vast majority of so called ' Trainers' out there who know jack.
To get the knowledge will take 5 years, and you have only finished when you add a degree to your name, as that degree will reflect on all your learning to date.

It will cost you £5,000 or more in total and an incredible amount of work. But anyone can do it if they put in the effort.


EXCELSIOR TRAINING 
James Dawson Grade 6 ADI (Ordit Registered) Ba (Hons) Driver Education
ADI qualification/Check test training/Excelsior DSA Ordit/fleet courses
Johnny boy United 20 its coming son

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#55 06-01-07 20:02:27

timmanwaringadi
Verified Member
From: Devon
Registered: 29-08-06
Posts: 2,406
Website

Re: Should all trainers be a grade 6

Completely agree hector, apart from the bit where you say you'll have finished when you've got the degree! I don't reckon you'll stop there - you'll find something else to study, or you'll start writing books about how to get there!

Still, the Captain and I will have to start somewhere. I'm starting with ORDIT and the Dip DI.

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#56 06-01-07 20:09:21

hector
Verified Member
From: Manchester
Registered: 04-04-06
Posts: 2,097
Website

Re: Should all trainers be a grade 6

Dont think ill ever finish the damn thing to be honest, i wished they did refunds!


EXCELSIOR TRAINING 
James Dawson Grade 6 ADI (Ordit Registered) Ba (Hons) Driver Education
ADI qualification/Check test training/Excelsior DSA Ordit/fleet courses
Johnny boy United 20 its coming son

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#57 06-01-07 20:11:41

comedrivewithme
Verified Member
From: Treorchy, Rhondda, South Wales
Registered: 28-11-06
Posts: 674
Website

Re: Should all trainers be a grade 6

The ADI's who use one centre train on the routes and do bu gger all else will always have a high pass rate. The quality ADI teaching safe driving for life may well have a lower rate.

I was covering 3 different test centres and didn't know half of the test routes.  I now cover mainly one test centre, although I don't spend much time on the test routes themselves.  My pups will be familiar with the areas, but won't know them like the back of their hand.

I take them into Cardiff test areas(I use the Pontypridd test centre) and into the City Centre, so they are reading the road ahead, not just learning the pitfalls.  I like to think I teach safe driving, as well as getting them through their test.  I'd wouldn't like to think of them going shopping in the City and that was the first time they'd driven there.  I've been known to take them into multi story car parks too.


Give yourself independenc, learn to drive!
www.Comedrivewithme.com
    Treorchy, Rhondda.

I see friends shaking hands, saying
"how do you do". 
They're really saying
"I love you" (Louie Armstrong)

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#58 06-01-07 20:13:01

hector
Verified Member
From: Manchester
Registered: 04-04-06
Posts: 2,097
Website

Re: Should all trainers be a grade 6

The ordit is given to the quality of the training programme provided.

Hi Martin
this isnt the case the ordit is given to the individual trainer based on their performance. The badge belongs to the trainer nothing to do with the company. The daft loophole of course is the companys can have a certain amount of trainers- 'Training' and how many isnt checked.


EXCELSIOR TRAINING 
James Dawson Grade 6 ADI (Ordit Registered) Ba (Hons) Driver Education
ADI qualification/Check test training/Excelsior DSA Ordit/fleet courses
Johnny boy United 20 its coming son

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#59 06-01-07 20:26:53

hector
Verified Member
From: Manchester
Registered: 04-04-06
Posts: 2,097
Website

Re: Should all trainers be a grade 6

Comedrivewithme -Not having a dig at you !

You would be much more likely to have a higher pass rate than a grade six trainer as Tim mentions above about effort certainly as a trainee, the reason being you would try much harder and put your heart and soul into it.
Fresh knowledge of correct procedures also counts big time.

Any grade instructor after doing this job for a period of time with learners will eventually go stir crazy!
I cant remember ever seeing an instructor with more than 10 years under his/her belt with anything other than a crap attitude to L training.

The vast majority havnt got a clue about how to train learners and still teach outdated practice. How do they pass check tests? They dont! they get missed out and havnt had one for years- ESPECIALLY IF THEY HAVE A SIX!

Role on the next few months when normal examiners start check testing and start to catch up with them!


EXCELSIOR TRAINING 
James Dawson Grade 6 ADI (Ordit Registered) Ba (Hons) Driver Education
ADI qualification/Check test training/Excelsior DSA Ordit/fleet courses
Johnny boy United 20 its coming son

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#60 06-01-07 20:29:40

timmanwaringadi
Verified Member
From: Devon
Registered: 29-08-06
Posts: 2,406
Website

Re: Should all trainers be a grade 6

Yep, I'd trust a new, enthusiastic grade 4 instructor over a jaded grade 6 any day.

Hector - have you seen the suggestions they are thinking about with regards check tests?

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#61 06-01-07 20:48:33

captainhook
Verified Member
Registered: 12-06-06
Posts: 2,197
Website

Re: Should all trainers be a grade 6

Hector what did you mean by normal examiners?


For intensive driving courses or weekly lessons from a driving school using the latest Audi A3 - covering the Slough and surrounding areas - visit www.go-pass-driving-school.co.uk

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#62 06-01-07 20:53:40

hector
Verified Member
From: Manchester
Registered: 04-04-06
Posts: 2,097
Website

Re: Should all trainers be a grade 6

In the very near future normal examiners NOT SUPERVISING EXAMINERS will start to conduct check tests (in addition to the SE's.)


EXCELSIOR TRAINING 
James Dawson Grade 6 ADI (Ordit Registered) Ba (Hons) Driver Education
ADI qualification/Check test training/Excelsior DSA Ordit/fleet courses
Johnny boy United 20 its coming son

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#63 06-01-07 20:55:47

captainhook
Verified Member
Registered: 12-06-06
Posts: 2,197
Website

Re: Should all trainers be a grade 6

After suitable extra training i hope. is this all part of the latest clamp down on all areas of adi training?


For intensive driving courses or weekly lessons from a driving school using the latest Audi A3 - covering the Slough and surrounding areas - visit www.go-pass-driving-school.co.uk

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#64 06-01-07 22:08:47

marconi1
Verified Member
From: Dawlish
Registered: 25-02-04
Posts: 693
Website

Re: Should all trainers be a grade 6

It is certainly the way way I went Hector

DIAmond advance
Diploma
Fleet register
City and giulds 7407
Cardington grade A
ORDIT
And many workshops with DIA and AIRSO
AA training courses for what the were worth
  sad sad sad


Dave Foster MA, Dip.DI
F.inst.D.E.R, M.Inst.MTD, M.A.I.R.O, A.I.F.L,
Foster the Joy of Driving
http://dte-elite.co.uk  http://drivertrainingeducation.co.uk

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#65 16-05-07 21:45:06

Bob_Morton
Verified Member
From: Pontefract, West Yorkshire
Registered: 16-05-07
Posts: 23
Website

Re: Should all trainers be a grade 6

All interesting stuff

Forgive me I'm new here, but the reality is that you don't even have to be an ADI to offer driving instructor training!

how crazy is that?

Should ADI Trainers be grade 6?

well not necessarily, the difference between a grade 5 and 6 is not so big, however the difference between a grade 4 and a grade 5 is quite large, grade 4 can be seen as "pretty competent" and grade 5 as "knows what they are doing" grade 6?....good instructor having a good day

ORDIT is the kite-mark (not made up or instigated by B.S.M. as was stated earlier, but a government body....the D.S.A.) anyone who carries it (individually....check the badge) knows what they are doing


RoSPA Advanced Dip Di, DTLLS, Assessor, Verifier, fleet trainer. Offer fleet, teacher & assessor training

ADI since 1989

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#66 16-05-07 22:11:08

Michael (in Croydon)
Verified Member
From: Croydon south London
Registered: 20-05-06
Posts: 224

Re: Should all trainers be a grade 6

Hi Bob and welcome

ORDIT is the kite-mark (not made up or instigated by B.S.M. as was stated earlier, but a government body....the D.S.A.) anyone who carries it (individually....check the badge) knows what they are doing

If only that were true!  maybe it should say - Should know what they are doing.
its possible to be a grade 4 and on the ORDIT register!


You can tell a horse to drink a thousand times, but all you really need to do is help him realise he’s thirsty. (Coaching)"

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#67 16-05-07 23:20:01

Bob_Morton
Verified Member
From: Pontefract, West Yorkshire
Registered: 16-05-07
Posts: 23
Website

Re: Should all trainers be a grade 6

that is of course correct

but consistently grade 4 instructors (say two check tests in a row) are unlikely to get on or indeed stay on the ordit register

however as we know the check test is a snapshot in time and not necessarily a true reflection of a particular ADI's ability. Having said that,  instructors who normally recieve grade 5 or 6, sitting a check test, and being graded a grade 4 should be looking to request another check test at the earliest opportunity....... surely?


RoSPA Advanced Dip Di, DTLLS, Assessor, Verifier, fleet trainer. Offer fleet, teacher & assessor training

ADI since 1989

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#68 16-05-07 23:35:00

Michael (in Croydon)
Verified Member
From: Croydon south London
Registered: 20-05-06
Posts: 224

Re: Should all trainers be a grade 6

Unfortunately not all ORDIT instructors are good
and I also feel that you should not be allowed to stay on the ORDIT register if you can only get a grade 4


You can tell a horse to drink a thousand times, but all you really need to do is help him realise he’s thirsty. (Coaching)"

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#69 16-05-07 23:45:05

Bob_Morton
Verified Member
From: Pontefract, West Yorkshire
Registered: 16-05-07
Posts: 23
Website

Re: Should all trainers be a grade 6

now don't start me on that......



I think we are in agreement, but a grade 4 doesn't always necessarily mean you are bad!  nor does a grade 5 mean you are really good.



cor

that almost sounded philosophical


RoSPA Advanced Dip Di, DTLLS, Assessor, Verifier, fleet trainer. Offer fleet, teacher & assessor training

ADI since 1989

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#70 17-05-07 15:17:46

striker
Verified Member
From: Yorkshire
Registered: 17-05-07
Posts: 2

Re: Should all trainers be a grade 6

Well Bob I must have had a good day on my last 5 check tests as I gained a 6 on all of them(only joking) I have also gained a grade 6 for the last 10 years on ADITE pre ORDIT and ORDIT.
During this time I have met and spoke to many a trainer some who have been grade 4s when they started their training, took ORDIT and achieved a grade 5. Followed on by gaining a 6 on the next check test. On the other hand I have known grade 6 instructors who could make the grade for ORDIT as they couldn't swap their "hat" and move on from teaching learners. So if you have a grade 4 who has potential to become a trainer should we stop them from having a go at climbing the ladder?


No Pain No Gain

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#71 17-05-07 15:23:00

timmanwaringadi
Verified Member
From: Devon
Registered: 29-08-06
Posts: 2,406
Website

Re: Should all trainers be a grade 6

Carrying on from that - how does someone who is about to go through ORDIT go about getting customers?

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#72 17-05-07 15:42:26

ijmoore
Verified Member
From: Staffordshire
Registered: 25-10-06
Posts: 1,077
Website

Re: Should all trainers be a grade 6

By being dead good! LOL  (word of mouth)

A bit of inital advertising, shame I don't know someone up your neck of the woods who's looking to be an ADI cos I'd throw them your way!

Round here I'd send them to Nigel, definately! 

Oh and throwing a spanner in the works.......Been Grade 6 AND ORDIT registered WITH an excellent reputation helps too!  any other qualifications help.....strangely I know someone like that....LOL


Fleet Training
Iain Moore ADI Grade A, Fleet, RoSPA Tutor, DIAmond Ad, MSA National B Race License, EST Reg
fleet@learnmooredriving.co.uk 07999 992141

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#73 17-05-07 15:45:54

pj
Verified Member
From: surrey
Registered: 27-02-05
Posts: 1,794

Re: Should all trainers be a grade 6

uuummmm wonder who that is neutral lol lol lol begins with N and ends with L big_smile


PJ Dip DI

if you always do what you've always done, you'll always get what you've always got.

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#74 17-05-07 15:49:07

ijmoore
Verified Member
From: Staffordshire
Registered: 25-10-06
Posts: 1,077
Website

Re: Should all trainers be a grade 6

LOL smile As if!


Fleet Training
Iain Moore ADI Grade A, Fleet, RoSPA Tutor, DIAmond Ad, MSA National B Race License, EST Reg
fleet@learnmooredriving.co.uk 07999 992141

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#75 17-05-07 15:49:58

timmanwaringadi
Verified Member
From: Devon
Registered: 29-08-06
Posts: 2,406
Website

Re: Should all trainers be a grade 6

Niel, Noel, Nathaniel.....no, you've lost me there - maybe hector will know?!  big_smile

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