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#1 07-03-07 19:40:51

timmanwaringadi
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From: Devon
Registered: 29-08-06
Posts: 2,406
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Hints and tips for Fleet standard commentary driving

I've only ever done commentary driving for myself and for customers, so what does the commentary drive on Fleet require? Hints and tips appreciated. Thanks in advance.

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07-03-07 19:40:51

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Re: Hints and tips for Fleet standard commentary driving



#2 08-03-07 19:12:06

jonnmedds
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From: Staffordshire
Registered: 25-02-04
Posts: 154

Re: Hints and tips for Fleet standard commentary driving

Say what you see.
The one problem i had with commentry was that i was just pointing out hazards, you need to point out the hazards but also suggest the action you'll take. If theres no hazards to talk about whats the road surface like and check the gauges in the car.
hope this helps, you'll soon get the hang of it.

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#3 08-03-07 19:30:54

timmanwaringadi
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From: Devon
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Posts: 2,406
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#4 08-03-07 19:37:55

hector
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From: Manchester
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Re: Hints and tips for Fleet standard commentary driving

Am i allowed to give tips ;D ;D


EXCELSIOR TRAINING 
James Dawson Grade 6 ADI (Ordit Registered) Ba (Hons) Driver Education
ADI qualification/Check test training/Excelsior DSA Ordit/fleet courses
Johnny boy United 20 its coming son

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#5 08-03-07 19:40:19

timmanwaringadi
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From: Devon
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Re: Hints and tips for Fleet standard commentary driving

As many as you like nigel! Oh, and by the way I finally found POWER in roadcraft - felt proper silly not having checked the appendices!

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#6 08-03-07 20:33:39

hector
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Re: Hints and tips for Fleet standard commentary driving

John hits the nail on the head above.

What's required is a descriptive commentary.Your fleet client will need to know what you see,when you see it and what action you intend to take and why you took that action.
They need to know what you are doing with the gearbox and engine to save fuel, explain gear selection,braking and observations and forward planning
Talkthrough the main scanning areas near/middle and far distance.
Give discriptive talkthrough on dealing with bends using IPSGA.
Descibe your use of appropiate signalling again explaining why you sometimes signal and sometimes dont. Explain your mirror use in the same way.

Never had anyone do it in the right way yet so dont worry!


EXCELSIOR TRAINING 
James Dawson Grade 6 ADI (Ordit Registered) Ba (Hons) Driver Education
ADI qualification/Check test training/Excelsior DSA Ordit/fleet courses
Johnny boy United 20 its coming son

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#7 08-03-07 20:35:54

timmanwaringadi
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From: Devon
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Re: Hints and tips for Fleet standard commentary driving

Ta Nigel, that helps as well, I look forward to doing it interestingly wrong!

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#8 11-06-07 01:07:33

EKAL
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From: East Kilbride
Registered: 23-04-06
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Re: Hints and tips for Fleet standard commentary driving

be aware of putting too much commentary in and not enough explanation, remember you can have two types commentary on advanced drives?
1 - Demonstration commentary drive 
2 - Instructional commentary drive

having not done any fleet yet I'm not sure how the mix would go?

>>>>>>>>calling Hector>>>>>.......

one phrase i like on the instructional drive is "if you look with me"


DSA ADI, DSA Fleet, RoADAR Diploma, RoADAR Gold.
SAFED for LGV/HGV - SAFED train the trainer
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www.agnewdrivertraining.co.uk

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#9 11-06-07 13:05:16

Doc
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Re: Hints and tips for Fleet standard commentary driving

The way i lead pupils/pdi's into commentary is to begin simple and build on that. firstly they could be doing commentary on the use of mspsl on approach to junctions. Then introduce commentary that involves more detail ie; it is a closed junction with a car parked opposite. This again can be given in greater detail ie; at the end of the road i am turning left. It is a closed junction with a car parked opposite. I am checking my mirrors, signalling left and correcting my position. I am now slowing down. I can see over the wall to my right that the road is clear but i can't see what is to my left. i am selecting 1st gear and looking left, right and left again. The road is clear so i am applying gas and slowly raising the clutch and turning into the new road. I am checking my mirrors (no/traffic following) and taking up my position on the road etc etc. After that i would take them onto busier settings (traffic lights/pedestrian crossings etc) and begin working on near/middle/far.

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#10 11-06-07 15:41:00

timmanwaringadi
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Re: Hints and tips for Fleet standard commentary driving

I'm sure I posted a reply to this earlier today - must be going mad (der).

When I did my own commentary driving on the fleet course it was quite acceptable apparently. What Nigel was looking for was descriptive commentary well in advance of hazards, and describing the actions taken in preparation and during the hazard with the elimination of risk being the main priority.

As long as you are looking ahead and give yourself time to talk through what you see, what you are doing and why (before you actually do it rather than " I just looked in my mirrors, then held off on a signal because the moped rider was about to crash into me...."), it's no problem.

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#11 11-06-07 15:45:10

copone
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From: Co. Durham
Registered: 03-07-05
Posts: 89

Re: Hints and tips for Fleet standard commentary driving

To continue from what Doc was saying. Don't forget to mention road/weather conditions. Even when you start to pull away, mention 'brake test' and explain why, having done a demonstration. Otherwise take note of everyone elses comments.


ADI. Class 1 Police Advanced. HGV Class 1. Member of IAM AND DIA. Rospa Gold. National Diploma for Advanced Instruction. and Examiner. IAM fleet trainer. Safed trainer.

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#12 11-06-07 21:10:22

ExAdiNigel
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From: Plymouth, Devon
Registered: 13-12-04
Posts: 4,739

Re: Hints and tips for Fleet standard commentary driving

The way i lead pupils/pdi's into commentary is to begin simple and build on that. firstly they could be doing commentary on the use of mspsl on approach to junctions. ....

The fact that this thread is in the  'Fleet trainers' section, I would encourage the use of IPSGA rather than MSPSL.

Nigel


National Standards Cycling Instructor, Ex Adi

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#13 11-06-07 21:26:28

Doc
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Re: Hints and tips for Fleet standard commentary driving

I wasn't sure of any differences which is why i quoted learners and pdi's. What exactly does IPSGA stand for?

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#14 11-06-07 22:17:26

storminnorman
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From: Norfolk
Registered: 16-09-06
Posts: 84
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Re: Hints and tips for Fleet standard commentary driving

Doc

IPSGA

Information
Position
Speed
Gear
Acceleration

It's a standard Roadcraft procedure, the IAM use it and it sounds from what I have read above in this post that the DSA expect it as well.  Works very well for loads of situations and hazards.  I coach it as an observer for the IAM and use it lots in my work (fleet training).


ADI Grade 6
DSA Fleet Register
Qualified PCV Instructor
SAFED Bus & Coach / LGV / Aggregates Trainer
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#15 12-06-07 00:17:37

Doc
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Re: Hints and tips for Fleet standard commentary driving

Cheers norman

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#16 12-06-07 05:42:03

ExAdiNigel
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From: Plymouth, Devon
Registered: 13-12-04
Posts: 4,739

Re: Hints and tips for Fleet standard commentary driving

MSPSL is a more rigid version of IPSGA.

In all honesty it probably doesn't really matter and I was being a little pedantic, though if someone was training to take the IAM or RoSPA tests the examiner would much prefer to hear IPSGA being used than MSPSL.

Nigel


National Standards Cycling Instructor, Ex Adi

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#17 12-06-07 06:40:34

ijmoore
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From: Staffordshire
Registered: 25-10-06
Posts: 1,077
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Re: Hints and tips for Fleet standard commentary driving

When teaching sometimes it is useful to break up the commentry into specific tasks.....

So within IPSGA, you could talk about the "information" elelment" of it, and how it is important throughout the process.....and relating it to what you can/cannot see.

Commentry I find is an affective tool, as suggested before for demo, and instruction.  The roadcraft dvd/video gives some excellent commentry, or I could just give you a tape of some of my pupils....its better commentry than mine! grrrrrrrr


Fleet Training
Iain Moore ADI Grade A, Fleet, RoSPA Tutor, DIAmond Ad, MSA National B Race License, EST Reg
fleet@learnmooredriving.co.uk 07999 992141

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#18 12-06-07 07:20:57

timmanwaringadi
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From: Devon
Registered: 29-08-06
Posts: 2,406
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Re: Hints and tips for Fleet standard commentary driving

Yep, def use roadcraft for experienced drivers (even some talented learners benefit from it). It seems to make sense more to them.

And the rural roads section (limit point) is miles better than Essential Skills.

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