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#1 27-02-07 15:05:21

Jimothy
Verified Member
From: Cheshire
Registered: 19-04-06
Posts: 224

First IAM observed drive today.

With not a little trepidation I undertook, this morning, my first observed drive prior to taking my IAM test.

Thanks to the kind assistance of Kev D and a lot of thought and sweating by yours truly, the BGOL issue appears to be resolved. Which probably means I need to think about it even more at this stage so that it doesn't return.

The issues which my observer identified were, I think, fair comment and grounds for me to change my driving style from the DSA style so deeply indoctrinated into me during part 2 training towards the Roadcraft style required by the IAM. So the observers comments were - too many signals given without thought for who would benefit (if anyone), and insufficient use of positioning in bends for visibility. Also 1 single occasion of accelerating before passing a national speed limit sign ( to be fair I noticed it myself) which, I accept is not correct driving practice, but as a one off it shouldn't cause me any problems to get right in the future. Oh and he also said that on a couple of occasions I didn't make sufficient progress - this is possibly the only contentious issue about the session, I consider that my progress was in keeping with the prevailing situation on the road - I shall keep an eye on progress in future and see what I think.

So all in all it wasn't too painful and I don't consider that I embarrassed myself. My next observed drive is booked for the back end of next week, so I need to have got things right by then.

So finally a big thanks to Kev D for his assistance and to a couple of IAM members on the forum for their words of advice in the chat room.

To be continued........


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27-02-07 15:05:21

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Re: First IAM observed drive today.




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#2 27-02-07 15:14:53

c-way
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From: Peterborough
Registered: 03-10-06
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Re: First IAM observed drive today.

Good luck with your IAM test Jimothy, I took mine last November and all the faults that were identified with your driving - I got them all too!  Like you said, need to get your DSA head off and your IAM head on!  I loved the different driving style and it really got me thinking more about my driving particularly with the mirrors, signals and position on roads  - straightlining the corners was really tricky at first but a lot of fun once my confidence grew.  smile

I'm now training to become an observer with my local group and find it really worthwhile taking out associates to help them prepare for their test.


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#3 08-03-07 20:43:19

Jimothy
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From: Cheshire
Registered: 19-04-06
Posts: 224

Re: First IAM observed drive today.

I had my second observed drive today.

The observer only made 1 comment about my driving - I missed a couple of opportunites to make better progress. When I politely defended one of those occasions the observer caved in totally. Could it be that he feels intimidated by the green and orange badges on my windscreeen?

I had hoped for a much more constructive set of comments DURING the drive rather than afterwards.


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#4 08-03-07 20:48:46

kev elliott
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Re: First IAM observed drive today.

jimothy,
The national guidelines for observer training i think recommend that the observations are given when the car is stationary. This is to avoid any accusations that observers teach driving. You should see some of the knots they get into over the difference between teaching and observing. All unnecessary because they do not get paid in any form.

#5 08-03-07 21:00:08

Jimothy
Verified Member
From: Cheshire
Registered: 19-04-06
Posts: 224

Re: First IAM observed drive today.

Thanks for that Kev. Is it within the guidelines to stop the car during the drive so that the associate can try and put into practice the comments made by the observer whilst he still has the observer in the car?


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#6 08-03-07 21:06:20

kev elliott
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Re: First IAM observed drive today.

As far as i am aware that is what is recommended, must admit though i tended to do it on the move else the ?????? forgot lol

#7 08-03-07 21:23:08

Jimothy
Verified Member
From: Cheshire
Registered: 19-04-06
Posts: 224

Re: First IAM observed drive today.

Well that would have been OK. On the two runs so far I have had no comments at all until the very end. Is he scaredI'll make him walkif he critises my driving? LOL


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#8 08-03-07 21:48:23

pegasus
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From: north west
Registered: 25-02-05
Posts: 3,297

Re: First IAM observed drive today.

Hi

As far as i am aware that is what is recommended, must admit though i tended to do it on the move else the ?????? forgot lol

But then you are an ADI, whether you are being paid or not doesn't matter in your case.

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#9 09-03-07 05:09:28

kev elliott
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Re: First IAM observed drive today.

Hi

kev elliott wrote:

As far as i am aware that is what is recommended, must admit though i tended to do it on the move else the ?????? forgot lol

But then you are an ADI, whether you are being paid or not doesn't matter in your case.

This was before i was an adi lol

#10 16-03-07 10:22:58

Jimothy
Verified Member
From: Cheshire
Registered: 19-04-06
Posts: 224

Re: First IAM observed drive today.

I had my third bserved run yesterday.

My observer asked me to do a commentary which went very well. He actually said that he was impressed smile

He still has concerns about me making enough progress, so maybe I should get some blues and twos off Ebay?
I really don't get the obsession with making progress, and looking to overtake when it's plain to an imbecile that there is not going to be an opportunity. If the opportunity is there, then I'll take it. But what is the point in looking for an opportunity when you know that there isn't going to be one?

Anyway apparently I am almost ready for a check run.

Well we'll see what happens next week.


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#11 16-03-07 11:34:53

kev elliott
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Re: First IAM observed drive today.

Jim,
we had this discussion in PLymouth recently - what the examiner fed back to the observors was that he wanted to see how the candidates would prepare for an overtake, it may well be that the overtake is not a possibility but the examiner would be able to see that the candidate understood the principles of at least the early stages. His point was to be in the position to take advantage of the opportunity if it did arise.

#12 16-03-07 11:42:31

Brucie
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Re: First IAM observed drive today.

I get the feeling that we as ADI's sometimes tend to drive like learners. Not being nasty but I think we have a tendency to do this prehaps without realising it. I know when I did my IAM, the guy knew I could drive, and started to drop hints! Then I was ok. How many others think we could fall into this trap of driving like a pupil!!??

#13 16-03-07 16:02:51

kev elliott
Guest

Re: First IAM observed drive today.

Brucie,
That is very true, I remember talking an instructor in Plymouth a few years ago- he was very aware of the fact that for the majority of the day he was sat next to inexperienced drivers and noticed that his driving was beginning to decline. His solution was simple - he became an obsever for the local IAM group to make sure that he was exposed to better driving.   


I myself am an observer and find it a useful tool for exactly that reason - sometimes you have to debate your point of view with an unqualified person but have never found that to be a problem as it is also good practise for the pup who thinks they know it all.


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#14 16-03-07 16:46:01

kjs
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From: Rossendale Lancashire
Registered: 20-05-06
Posts: 976
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Re: First IAM observed drive today.

I found that when I did my training for the ROSPA test, that , because the observers knew that I was an ADI, they were some how a bit reserved in telling me what I was doing wrong. I had to tell them in the end to ignore what I did for a living, and to tell me if I was doing anything wrong. After all, they as observers Know what the examiner is looking for, me as a trainee knew nothing so to speak. Once I had told them that I didn't mind being told about my driving it made a big difference and a passed with a gold award.

kjs

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#15 16-03-07 20:40:25

Leprechaun
Member
Registered: 19-03-06
Posts: 264

Re: First IAM observed drive today.

Ok i'll bite

I am an IAM observer as well and to be brutally honest taking out ADIs does worry me  :oops: :oops: I'm always concerned i won't find anything wrong with their driving or i'll say something and they will then debate the point and i'll back down  :oops: I need more confidence in my own ability as an observer but i'm not sure where i'm going to drag that up from  neutral :oops:

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#16 16-03-07 20:54:05

EKAL
Verified Member
From: East Kilbride
Registered: 23-04-06
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Re: First IAM observed drive today.

I am an Advanced tutor within RoADAR and have now been out with a few ADI's and have NEVER felt concerned I wouldn't find anything wrong with their driving, YES as stated above, a few ADI's slip into Learner driving mode, but that in itself is not a fault.
I was allocated an ADI not so long ago who was a good driver and very Knowledgeable, I gained as much from him as he did from me, but the lesson plan which really separated the ADI from the Advanced driver(on this occasion) was making progress using Limit point analysis, I really enjoy using limits points but on this occasion I enjoyed even more, watching the ADI's face when he mastered it.


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#17 16-03-07 21:37:48

kev elliott
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Re: First IAM observed drive today.

Lep,
ADI's are just normal people, if they did not want your opinion they would not join the IAM.

Remember as long as you give your honest opinion then all you doing is saying what you think. ADI's are trained to teach driving, however EVERYBODY has a valid opinion. If you cannot find something wrong with thier driving then that is fine, it is also possible to take out a member of the public and find nothing wrong with their driving.

As far as debating your point goes if you have the facts as you see them then use the opportunity to discuss  the differences - it maybe because the audience is diffrent for the ADI - road positioning is different for one thing because of the ability of a learner to adjust position is diffrent to that of an experienced driver.

#18 16-03-07 22:30:36

kjs
Verified Member
From: Rossendale Lancashire
Registered: 20-05-06
Posts: 976
Website

Re: First IAM observed drive today.

All I would say to you Lep is, ADI or not, If you dont tell me when I do something wrong how can I put it right. This is the point I was trying to put across. Just because I'm an ADI, doesn't meen that my drive will be perfect. TELL ME when I make a mistake.

We come to IAM, ROSPA etc , to improve our driving, not to try and catch you out. Once I'd got this across the observers had no problems at all in correcting me.

kjs

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#19 20-03-07 19:50:28

Van Man
Verified Member
From: Burton upon Trent
Registered: 12-01-06
Posts: 78

Re: First IAM observed drive today.

at our group, we have two ADI's and I have taken them both out. Both very good drivers but they were the first to admit they are not perfect and wanted to improve their skills smile I think the problem comes in, and we could start a new thread on this, is the differance between IAM and DSA. This Sunday on the latest I caught him out on a BGOL and then had to point out about getting the speed right for the hazzard. But we didn't fall out about it, infact he said that some of the stuff I had told him on a previous drive, he now incrperates in his lessons big_smile


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#20 22-03-07 14:17:42

Jimothy
Verified Member
From: Cheshire
Registered: 19-04-06
Posts: 224

Re: First IAM observed drive today.

Just back from my fourth observed run.

I seem to have got my progress the way the IAM like it. I'm now waiting a date for a check run wihth the senior observer.


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#21 27-03-07 18:32:06

Jimothy
Verified Member
From: Cheshire
Registered: 19-04-06
Posts: 224

Re: First IAM observed drive today.

Check run is now scheduled for Tuesday 3 April

Will have the new car by then smile

Should I ask you to wish me luck?


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#22 27-03-07 21:23:22

c-way
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From: Peterborough
Registered: 03-10-06
Posts: 1,170
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Re: First IAM observed drive today.

You know you dont' need to be wished luck Jimothy, go and do what you have been advised to do!  Have a great drive  smile


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#23 27-03-07 21:39:24

Jimothy
Verified Member
From: Cheshire
Registered: 19-04-06
Posts: 224

Re: First IAM observed drive today.

Thanks C-way..

I'm just concerned I might drop a clanger and make myself looklike a total nob.


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#24 28-03-07 20:02:15

kev elliott
Guest

Re: First IAM observed drive today.

Jim,
May the Force be with you   big_smile


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#25 01-04-07 15:40:31

ijmoore
Verified Member
From: Staffordshire
Registered: 25-10-06
Posts: 1,077
Website

Re: First IAM observed drive today.

You'll be ok Mr! just enjoy it, and learn from the experience.  I'd like to do mine soon, so you'll have to let me know how you got on!

Its interesting about driving like a learner.  I've thought about that today! I think many learners nearly test ready, drive MUCH better that most drivers anyway.  I had an older gentleman reversing today, not in reverse gear, didn't look, and nearly "rolled" into my new car! grrrrr

Silly old man, he did realise when I used my horn briefly.  But he didn't even look my way!? My learners would never do that! You see them try!

I think we drive like very good learners, I'm glad we don't drive as much like the other drivers on the road.  Main one is speed limits, it amazes me how many people don't understand them!


Fleet Training
Iain Moore ADI Grade A, Fleet, RoSPA Tutor, DIAmond Ad, MSA National B Race License, EST Reg
fleet@learnmooredriving.co.uk 07999 992141

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