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#1 26-11-06 00:59:38

keith williams
Verified Member
From: Bangor, Northern Ireland
Registered: 28-08-06
Posts: 458

Part3 training, first lessons

Hi all, just wanted to get the opinions of some good trainers...

What do you do with the PDI on their first couple of lessons?

Might sound like an obvious sort of question but I've been thinking about my own training and been talking to a lot of PDIs about the training they're receiving.

The common theme is that the first 10 hours or so is spent working on briefs, getting them right before even thinking about getting the car rolling.

This might be something unique to NI but I'm not sure.

My own opinion is that they should be learning the core competancies first, getting used to being in the passenger seat and sitting beside a learner (a pretty well behaved one at first). Even things like where to keep things in the car etc.

Then, once these things are looked at, moving onto the structure of the lesson (not the part3). Looking at re-caps, Q&A, setting aims and objectives and then a brief.

What do you think? Is this a usual thing on the mainland to just do nothing but briefs for hours on end and then learn how to pass the prt3 rather than actually learning how to instruct?

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26-11-06 00:59:38

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Re: Part3 training, first lessons




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#2 26-11-06 02:38:13

timmanwaringadi
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From: Devon
Registered: 29-08-06
Posts: 2,406
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Re: Part3 training, first lessons

You're right, jumping straight in to the pst's is daft, but unfortunately with the time restraints place on many of these courses (40 for ALL of the part 3 training), many trainers who work for the bigger companies feel that this is what they feel they need to do.

I don't do a huge amount of ADI training, but my first part3 session is on fault ID. From here you can work on everything else. Like you say, you can only really get to grips with briefings once you understand their context, and not knowing what will happen afterwards tends to cause problems.

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#3 26-11-06 07:25:07

hector
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From: Manchester
Registered: 04-04-06
Posts: 2,097
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Re: Part3 training, first lessons

Hi Keith heres what i do to teach them how to be a proper instructor:And this is why 20 hrs training only scratches the surface!!!

Training syllabus

Instructor characteristics
Instructor’s legal/moral obligations
Eyesight checks / Driver licensing
Route directions / Clear communication
Use of instructor’s mirrors / observations
Using dual controls / types of dual control
Professional introductions
Lesson structure / Timing
Eye contact /developing pupil interest
Pupil’s previous experience?
Prompts / lesson plans
Briefings / Q and A
The marking sheets / relevant faults
Talk through instruction / control
Q and A methods
Positive instruction / retrospective
Giving appropriate praise
Instructor’s theory knowledge
Level of instruction
Planning
Control of lesson
Communication
Q/Techniques
Feedback/Encouragement
Instructor’s use of controls

The core competencies

Driving test knowledge / Theory test knowledge
Advanced driving test knowledge
Fleet driver coaching methods
Route planning
Pupils test day what the instructor needs to know
Pass plus / advanced driver training/refresher training
Suitable training vehicle / test requirements

The above takes approx 40-50 hrs on a one to one basis, then another 20 hrs+ on pre set tests. 60 hrs minimum

Then think about pst's when the instructor can instruct!!!!

Theres no point teaching core competencies too early as they need to how to prevent faults occuring in the first place before sorting them out!

At the moment some trainers are jumping on the dont teach pst's band wagon and never teaching them! PDI's do need to know about them them though . just not on the first lesson!

IF ANYONE GOES ON THEIR FIRST SESSION AND ITS PRE-SET TEST 1 CONTROLS THEN THE ALARM BELLS SHOULD START RINGING.

Pointless as you havnt a clue what youre doing!!


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#4 26-11-06 09:23:38

Target
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From: Winchmore Hill North London
Registered: 17-01-05
Posts: 5,695
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Re: Part3 training, first lessons

The alarm bells never rang for me and i'm sure anyone else who goes with TIC.

There I was sitting in the passenger seat being asked to give a controls lesson on some brief I struggled like most to put together the night before.

Oh well.


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#5 26-11-06 12:54:15

keith williams
Verified Member
From: Bangor, Northern Ireland
Registered: 28-08-06
Posts: 458

Re: Part3 training, first lessons

Thanks Hector, that's a very informative post. I take it the syllabus is covered in the order written above?

I agree that the PSTs definitely need to be covered but not before they know how to be an instructor first.

Theres no point teaching core competencies too early as they need to how to prevent faults occuring in the first place before sorting them out!

A very important bit of advice there for me personally, I would've barged them in very early on I have to admit.

I can see now that the alarm bells should be deafening if PSTs are brought up in the first lesson. Unfortunately, the cotton wool balls were in when it happened to me. Lack of experience, isn't hindsight wonderful?

From talking to various PDIs though it would seem that a HUGE percentage of the trainers over here are doing it all wrong! In fact, to be totally honest I haven't heard one account of someone's part3 training that sounds right! Quite shocking really. I wonder is it just a coincidence that the DVTA (our regulating body) don't currently have an ORDIT register?

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#6 26-11-06 17:16:27

Trumper
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From: South west
Registered: 11-07-05
Posts: 251

Re: Part3 training, first lessons

Hector
Agree with your guide. Most of the big firms only give 40 hrs 2-1 training. So if you give 60hrs 1-1 that would mean the big firms giving 120 hrs 2-1 training.

Most of the big firms trainers have no say in how, what they teach, because of the time factor most of it is based on PST.


O.R.D.I.T. Dip D.I
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A.D.I  Car manual
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#7 26-11-06 17:44:57

keith williams
Verified Member
From: Bangor, Northern Ireland
Registered: 28-08-06
Posts: 458

Re: Part3 training, first lessons

At the AA ADI trainer training I attended we were told that once the pre-paid hours are used up then the PDI just pays by the hour. The emphasis was on using as much time as it needed to get them ready rather than rushing them through when their hours are up. Don't know if other organisations follow the same idea or not

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#8 26-11-06 19:25:24

marconi1
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From: Dawlish
Registered: 25-02-04
Posts: 693
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Re: Part3 training, first lessons

When I did the AA instructor training course to train the trainer it was not very good and they do not give their trainers any syllabus just expect them to make it up. Nearly all the trainers from the AA have gone out and got extra training that they had to pay for. The books given to the PDI were not of good quality either.


Dave Foster MA, Dip.DI
F.inst.D.E.R, M.Inst.MTD, M.A.I.R.O, A.I.F.L,
Foster the Joy of Driving
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#9 26-11-06 22:39:25

keith williams
Verified Member
From: Bangor, Northern Ireland
Registered: 28-08-06
Posts: 458

Re: Part3 training, first lessons

I think the problem with the course is the fact it was sold to the management as a 3day course, that's far too short. The trainers do a good job with the time they have but you have to expect to do more work over and above what you do with them to compensate.

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#10 26-11-06 22:57:38

captainhook
Verified Member
Registered: 12-06-06
Posts: 2,197
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Re: Part3 training, first lessons

Well with my training we did a morning in the classroom and an afternoon on the road.

In morning did everything from recap-objective-mains points-practice-summary.

Then went out on the road and tryed it in afternoon.

The truth of it is you shouldnt need to learn about core competencies because you should already know their faults having passed part 2. All you should have to know is how to deal with the faults.

Spot the fault      Anaylse it      Remedial action-Thats core competency.


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#11 26-11-06 23:01:04

captainhook
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Registered: 12-06-06
Posts: 2,197
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Re: Part3 training, first lessons

I had 60 hours 2-1 training for part 3 with TIC and could have had additional if i had wanted.

Plus if you fluff it on third attempt part 3 they will keep giving you training until you do pass.

That could amount to quite a few hours at no extra cost.

Though there was a get out clause for them saying if you are still having problems and are not taking the instruction of your trainer they will charge you for extras


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