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#1 04-05-14 07:48:46

gabby_adi
Member
Registered: 18-04-14
Posts: 29

Parallel Park - What is the most easiest way with no reference points?

I am just starting with teaching the parallel park to leaners  who are all finding it difficult because of the "reference points" in the door mirror...they find it difficult to judge the reference points and rightly so because if your a learner the last thing you want to think about are reference points. I use

1 turn left
2 turn right
1 left

With the reference point being either the wheel arch or the door handle - both which learners find difficult...I have only qualified recently so need to find the most simple method which always works first time

What is the most simple way to do the parallel park that works first time but is simple for the learner to use against any type/length of car?

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04-05-14 07:48:46

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Re: Parallel Park - What is the most easiest way with no reference points?



#2 04-05-14 08:15:33

Evan
Administrator
Registered: 27-12-09
Posts: 2,058

Re: Parallel Park - What is the most easiest way with no reference points?

Do you find pupils are struggling finding the reference point counting the two turns right, moving the car etc, then either hitting the kerb or being too far away?

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#3 04-05-14 08:18:40

Roadmaster
Verified Member
Registered: 04-03-04
Posts: 5,670

Re: Parallel Park - What is the most easiest way with no reference points?

Every ADI has their own method.  I use the left door mirror at end of car as a reference to turn right, but it's only 1 right not 2 as you do.  If they did 2 using my method they would be too far away from the kerb, as Evan mentions.

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#4 04-05-14 08:32:16

gabby_adi
Member
Registered: 18-04-14
Posts: 29

Re: Parallel Park - What is the most easiest way with no reference points?

The pupils either hit the kerb or are too far away, they can count the two turns left o.k but the same problem happens all the time.

I think are are struggling with the reference points in the door mirror - its making it over completed for them, do you have a simple method that is easy easy easy for all new learners to get right first time?

Evan wrote:

Do you find pupils are struggling finding the reference point counting the two turns right, moving the car etc, then either hitting the kerb or being too far away?

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#5 04-05-14 08:34:41

gabby_adi
Member
Registered: 18-04-14
Posts: 29

Re: Parallel Park - What is the most easiest way with no reference points?

Can you describe how you do your method please it sounds alot simpler to do and could be the easiest method to use, have you experienced any issues using your method - how do you gage the left door mirror at the end of car as reference as the point of turn to turn right?

Roadmaster wrote:

Every ADI has their own method.  I use the left door mirror at end of car as a reference to turn right, but it's only 1 right not 2 as you do.  If they did 2 using my method they would be too far away from the kerb, as Evan mentions.

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#6 04-05-14 08:38:09

Roadmaster
Verified Member
Registered: 04-03-04
Posts: 5,670

Re: Parallel Park - What is the most easiest way with no reference points?

gabby_adi wrote:

how do you gage the left door mirror at the end of car as reference as the point of turn to turn right?

You look to see if the left door mirror is level with the end of the car you are parking.

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#7 04-05-14 08:46:31

Lewinpeter1
Verified Member
From: Morpeth,Northumberland
Registered: 17-01-09
Posts: 803
Website

Re: Parallel Park - What is the most easiest way with no reference points?

Hi
My very simple method.
Keep the car really slow, look where you want to go, make sure its safe!
No ref. points.
If they struggle with this,then I give extra lnstruction but its amazing how many can just do it.
Peter


Dont press that,oh @@##!

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#8 04-05-14 09:05:57

Evan
Administrator
Registered: 27-12-09
Posts: 2,058

Re: Parallel Park - What is the most easiest way with no reference points?

Gabby can I ask if you are 100% sure where the car should be from the instructors position when you are teaching this and any manoeuvre, I am not being flip asking this question, its just that it is so important for you to feel confident where to stop your pupil then ask the question what can YOU see. Remember reference points change for each person that sits in your car, which is why I don't like the fixed reference point approach, neither do I like or have I ever used dots stuck on windows, I am not saying for one minute you use these methods!
I have found by experience it is easier to teach, asking what a pupil can see, rather than telling them what they should see. By doing this you teach them to use judgement in their own cars.
To do this method you must be a 100% sure of what you need to see from the instructors seat.

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#9 04-05-14 13:25:45

Lady-Hynarc
Verified Member
Registered: 09-04-12
Posts: 650

Re: Parallel Park - What is the most easiest way with no reference points?

Hi Gabby,

In addition to the answers already given, how do you parallel park?  Do you use reference points?  If so, what do you use?  Try to detail/itemise the method you use and then you may have an idea of how to tell your pupils to do it.

There is no foolproof, 'works every time' method because every car is different, every road is different and every situation is different.  You need to give them a baseline and then encourage them to think out any problems they encounter...otherwise the first time they have to parallel park without you, you'll get a panicky phone call!  big_smile

This answer kind of ties in with your other post regarding a lesson order.  I don't think you can be as rigid about it as that.  You have to be able to respond to different pupils, different abilities and different situations...  Having a plan is fine, having a rigid plan may suit some but will not suit others.

Be willing to be flexible  smile

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#10 04-05-14 17:45:01

martin Williams
Verified Member
Registered: 26-06-09
Posts: 1,144

Re: Parallel Park - What is the most easiest way with no reference points?

All ways have reference points unless you use the SYE and HFTB method.

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#11 04-05-14 17:59:04

Mentor
Verified Member
Registered: 22-10-05
Posts: 387

Re: Parallel Park - What is the most easiest way with no reference points?

I too use the 4 turn method but I have a cheat mirror (blindspot mirror on the left angled down to see the rear wheel) and find my pupils can do this manoeuvre with no problems, once they have memorised the process. As it relies on geometry principals using the kerb as a fixed point, it does work every time and can be relied upon for the test; so much so that most pupils actually want to get this manoeuvre on their test.

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#12 04-05-14 19:18:47

sofasurfer
Verified Member
From: Surrey
Registered: 30-07-13
Posts: 310

Re: Parallel Park - What is the most easiest way with no reference points?

How did you pass Part II and get a green badge if you don't have a method for the manoeuvres and no structure to your syllabus ?

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#13 04-05-14 19:52:09

la.monikita
Verified Member
From: SE LONDON / KENT
Registered: 12-03-05
Posts: 3,064

Re: Parallel Park - What is the most easiest way with no reference points?

I think Gabby might be a Fatima...who has a very sad life... hmm


"What is necessary to change a person is to change his awareness of himself."
Abraham Maslow

21st Century Women http://www.loisontheloose.com/my-advent … /the-team/

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#14 04-05-14 20:44:20

johnp
Verified Member
From: Dorset
Registered: 04-03-06
Posts: 2,636

Re: Parallel Park - What is the most easiest way with no reference points?

I only give them a couple of instructions.
Don't turn Left until the rear wheels / seat has passed the back of the car.
Then it is up to them to turn and get themselves parallel, usually using the door mirror to see.

It may be 1 turn left and 2 to right. But it is up to them how they do
It because they will never remember numbers or my way and all cars are different.

As long as they are clear of the parked car, they can experiment safely to get their own judgement in place.


Driving is books-
1. "safe and responsible INDEPENDENCE."
2. "DISABILITY into ABILITY" 
3. "PSYCHOLOGY than SYSTEMS.
www.drivingincludesu.co.uk

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#15 04-05-14 21:47:04

sofasurfer
Verified Member
From: Surrey
Registered: 30-07-13
Posts: 310

Re: Parallel Park - What is the most easiest way with no reference points?

I think it's about time this forum vetted all new members and anyone claiming to be an ADI should be asked for ID.

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#16 04-05-14 22:33:06

Laurence Jacquemin ADI
Verified Member
From: Crawley, West Sussex
Registered: 26-11-13
Posts: 96
Website

Re: Parallel Park - What is the most easiest way with no reference points?

Evan wrote:

I have found by experience it is easier to teach, asking what a pupil can see, rather than telling them what they should see. By doing this you teach them to use judgement in their own cars.

Even if you get the pupil in the position where you would start turning it can still go wrong as this is when YOU start turning, for the speed of steering and speed of reversing YOU do. As I have done lots of parallel parks I can keep the car very very slow and steering very quick if I need to, a new learner may not have such fine clutch control or be able to steer as rapidly whilst keeping control. Basically I have found you have to be careful if you stop a pupil in a certain position as it only works if they are consistent with their speed and steering and this matches the reference point, which will change depending on the car being driven and car parking against. Which is why nowadays I do not do normally do reference points, just get the pupil to try, after a few goes most will 'get it', particularly the boys, the girls will normally steer back away from the kerb too late and hit the kerb, but they then learn they need to steer earlier, or steer faster to stop this from happening. Only time I may use reference points is if pupil is struggling then I will stop them where I would turn and get them to set a reference point and normally that helps a bit, but like I said it can still not work sometimes as pupils all steer at different speeds and have different levels of clutch control.

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#17 05-05-14 06:46:47

Evan
Administrator
Registered: 27-12-09
Posts: 2,058

Re: Parallel Park - What is the most easiest way with no reference points?

Lawrence this is where the skill of the instructor comes in and you have to sometimes break it down. What often happens as you know, is that as the pupil starts to steer they can bring the clutch up too quick. You can break it down further, the instructor can help with the clutch till they develop the correct steering technique. The other main problem pupils have with manoeuvres is visualising where the car is in relation to the kerb etc. if they struggle I do a demonstration of the PP (and indeed any other manoeuvre) with them standing on the kerb watching with the window open telling them what I am doing and watching for the key points in the exercise.
The TIR I always get them on a very quiet road and when they stop in at each point get them out of the car to see where the wheels are in relation to the kerb. Reference points are a complete waste of time if the pupil has no appreciation as to where the car is in the road.

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#18 05-05-14 06:49:14

Evan
Administrator
Registered: 27-12-09
Posts: 2,058

Re: Parallel Park - What is the most easiest way with no reference points?

NOTE:
The original poster seems to have lost interest in the thread they created. If the post was created as a wind up then the opposite has happened as it has prompted a debate about techniques, which will hopefully benefit some!

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#19 05-05-14 06:52:56

collywobs
Verified Member
From: Tonbridge Kent
Registered: 07-08-06
Posts: 479
Website

Re: Parallel Park - What is the most easiest way with no reference points?

I agree with Peter, for all manoeuvres a short briefing to explain what's required in terms of position, safety & observations, then let them have a go.
If they struggle, then help with further instructions firstly via Q&A and then use reference points as a last resort.
I have a set of photo's for each manoeuvre to point-out the reference points otherwise they might struggle to understand exactly what you're asking them to look for!
It really depends on the individual, some get it straight away, others just haven't got a clue!
Colin


Colin Kentish
Grade 6 DSA Approved Driving Instructor (car)
www.colinkentish.co.uk

Dream as if you'll live for ever
Live as if you'll die today

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#20 05-05-14 08:37:20

Laurence Jacquemin ADI
Verified Member
From: Crawley, West Sussex
Registered: 26-11-13
Posts: 96
Website

Re: Parallel Park - What is the most easiest way with no reference points?

Evan wrote:

Reference points are a complete waste of time if the pupil has no appreciation as to where the car is in the road.

Couldn't agree more on that Evan, when I was still fairly new to instructing I had a girl who could do a parallel park with reference points perfectly, but she never really understood where the car was in the road or about which way to steer when reversing, as such on her test she forgot about reference points and got in a muddle with the parallel park, forgetting to steer back to the right to get the car parallel to the kerb, causing a very difficult angle from the kerb which was almost impossible to recover from.

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#21 05-05-14 12:40:58

sofasurfer
Verified Member
From: Surrey
Registered: 30-07-13
Posts: 310

Re: Parallel Park - What is the most easiest way with no reference points?

I have a method for each of the manoeuvres which, if followed, results in the correct position and good observations. I have found that in the heat of the moment on test, it is helpful if they have a method to rely on. The proof of the pudding ? I use the same methods when I am driving. I can't remember the last time a pupil of mine failed on manoeuvres :-)

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#22 05-05-14 12:55:30

Roadmaster
Verified Member
Registered: 04-03-04
Posts: 5,670

Re: Parallel Park - What is the most easiest way with no reference points?

I use reference points when I'm maneouvring.

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#23 05-05-14 14:29:30

ADIALAN
Verified Member
From: NORTHAMPTON (UK)
Registered: 05-03-06
Posts: 741
Website

Re: Parallel Park - What is the most easiest way with no reference points?

Just do it yourself, then teach the pupil what you have just done. Simples wink


"There is only one difference between genius and stupidity - genius has its limits"

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#24 11-05-14 20:10:17

Robbie
Verified Member
From: Shrewsbury
Registered: 29-02-04
Posts: 1,230
Website

Re: Parallel Park - What is the most easiest way with no reference points?

I get my students to find their own way of doing it.
I usually tell them when pulling out from behind parked car to start position to remember how they did it going forward and do same in reverse.
After 3-4 goes they've got to grips with it.

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#25 11-05-14 20:56:42

martin Williams
Verified Member
Registered: 26-06-09
Posts: 1,144

Re: Parallel Park - What is the most easiest way with no reference points?

Robbie wrote:

I get my students to find their own way of doing it.
I usually tell them when pulling out from behind parked car to start position to remember how they did it going forward and do same in reverse.
After 3-4 goes they've got to grips with it.

Most of my pupils take much longer I must be doing something wrong  sad

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