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#1 10-07-11 15:30:45

greenyaris
Member
From: Mundesley, Norfolk, UK
Registered: 05-02-11
Posts: 53

Appalled

After a day  out with the IAM N. Norfolk riders, I was returning home to day on the dual A11 travelling at 77mph gauge indicated. 70mph sat nav indicated. Seeing an artic up ahead I moved out to the overtaking lane...also ahead in lane 1 was a learner school car which I thought at the time was leaving an overtake maneuver for the artic a little late. As I closed the distances, school car changes lane in front of me causing me to back off. When I eventually passed the car, it looked to me that the instructor was asleep. Well it was quite a warm day!


Dave b
drive safe   ride safe
IAM Rider & Driver

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10-07-11 15:30:45

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Re: Appalled



#2 10-07-11 15:48:16

on board training
Guest

Re: Appalled

Hi,

I would have thought you would have anticipated this rather than feeling they had caused you to back off.

Brian


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#3 10-07-11 16:06:01

greenyaris
Member
From: Mundesley, Norfolk, UK
Registered: 05-02-11
Posts: 53

Re: Appalled

Hi,

I would have thought you would have anticipated this rather than feeling they had caused you to back off.

Brian

Exactly so Brian. Except I didn't feel they had caused me to back off, the pupil did cause me to. If you are going faster than some-one who is in lane one there is a point, although ready for it, that you do not expect the vehicle to pull out in front of you. As I was ready for it, there is nothing more to be said, apart from the main point that you missed which was the instructor appeared to be asleep when I passed them.


Dave b
drive safe   ride safe
IAM Rider & Driver

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#4 10-07-11 16:14:14

on board training
Guest

Re: Appalled

Hi,

Didn't miss it, just chose to ignore it as there was nothing to show for definate it was an instructor on a lesson in what you had said - other than a learner car,someone driving and someone in passenger seat maybe asleep.

Brian


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#5 10-07-11 16:17:08

greenyaris
Member
From: Mundesley, Norfolk, UK
Registered: 05-02-11
Posts: 53

Re: Appalled

Hi,

Didn't miss it, just chose to ignore it
Brian

Touche, whatever  LOL


Dave b
drive safe   ride safe
IAM Rider & Driver

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#6 10-07-11 17:19:35

greenyaris
Member
From: Mundesley, Norfolk, UK
Registered: 05-02-11
Posts: 53

Re: Appalled

Why were you travelling at 77 mph?

I wasn't. My speedo reads 10% over true speed. 


Dave b
drive safe   ride safe
IAM Rider & Driver

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#7 10-07-11 17:21:58

Roadmaster
Verified Member
Registered: 04-03-04
Posts: 5,670

Re: Appalled

So do you teach your pupils to drive at 10% higher than the speedo shows because it's not accurate?

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#8 10-07-11 17:38:09

greenyaris
Member
From: Mundesley, Norfolk, UK
Registered: 05-02-11
Posts: 53

Re: Appalled

So do you teach your pupils to drive at 10% higher than the speedo shows because it's not accurate?

I have checked my speedo and know it has 10% inaccuracy across the range. Mine over-reads. The police also calibrate their instruments to true speed.( why?)
I don't teach, that is your profession. 


Dave b
drive safe   ride safe
IAM Rider & Driver

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#9 10-07-11 17:47:43

Roadmaster
Verified Member
Registered: 04-03-04
Posts: 5,670

Re: Appalled

I don't teach, that is your profession

That's a positive then. 

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#10 10-07-11 18:09:14

dth-adi
Verified Member
Registered: 19-09-04
Posts: 1,402

Re: Appalled

Good that you know that your speedo over-reads.

Not so good that you choose to ignore the in-built safety/prosecution margin and in addition, fail to plan for safety.

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#11 10-07-11 18:30:06

greenyaris
Member
From: Mundesley, Norfolk, UK
Registered: 05-02-11
Posts: 53

Re: Appalled

Good that you know that your speedo over-reads.

Not so good that you choose to ignore the in-built safety/prosecution margin and in addition, fail to plan for safety.

LOL. As you call it the 'built in safety' margin is not for your benefit, it is for manu so he doesn't get prosecuted for your alleged overspeeding. The prosecution margin as you well know is 10% over true plus 2mph. I was travelling at 70mph true. Now you do the figures.
Where did I not plan for safety? Oh, I get it...another of the do not overtake brigade as it is a considered dangerous maneuver.
This forum gets nit pickingly worse.


Dave b
drive safe   ride safe
IAM Rider & Driver

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#12 10-07-11 18:52:40

martin_t
Verified Member
Registered: 30-12-06
Posts: 357

Re: Appalled

dth-adi: 'in-built safety/prosecution margin' ??

It's nothing of the sort. The speedo is a guide that by law must not under-read. If a user has the resources to check the accuracy it would be perfectly reasonable to compensate for any inaccuracy found. (BTW, those resources are all around you and could even be used to calibrate a GPS).

on board training: 'I would have thought you would have anticipated this rather than feeling they had caused you to back off.'

Surely when planning an overtake one would factor in, i.e. anticipate or plan for, the overtake-ee getting it wrong. This would include backing off, the use of headlights, the use of the horn, or hard braking, none of which implies the overtake-er is less than completely competent. As it is entirely possible that the overtake-ee will attempt to steer right into the overtake-er as they are passing perhaps overtaking should be made illegal?

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#13 10-07-11 19:06:46

roadhog
Verified Member
From: West Midlands
Registered: 29-11-05
Posts: 481

Re: Appalled

And of course sat navs do not read the true speed on an incline, the steeper the incline the greater the disparity. (ie they give a lower reading).

roadhog


Quality is remembered long after the price is forgotten

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#14 10-07-11 19:21:36

greenyaris
Member
From: Mundesley, Norfolk, UK
Registered: 05-02-11
Posts: 53

Re: Appalled

dth-adi: 'in-built safety/prosecution margin' ??

It's nothing of the sort. The speedo is a guide that by law must not under-read. If a user has the resources to check the accuracy it would be perfectly reasonable to compensate for any inaccuracy found. (BTW, those resources are all around you and could even be used to calibrate a GPS). [img=Verdana]
I have, have you? Thank you, the speedo IS a quide. [/img]

on board training: 'I would have thought you would have anticipated this rather than feeling they had caused you to back off.'

Surely when planning an overtake one would factor in, i.e. anticipate or plan for, the overtake-ee getting it wrong. This would include backing off, the use of headlights, the use of the horn, or hard braking, none of which implies the overtake-er is less than completely competent. As it is entirely possible that the overtake-ee will attempt to steer right into the overtake-er as they are passing perhaps overtaking should be made illegal?

[img=Verdana]You forgot of course that maybe a tyre could burst, and either driver could fall asleep. Yes overtaking must be made illegal...I am right behind you in joining BRAKE[/img]


Dave b
drive safe   ride safe
IAM Rider & Driver

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#15 10-07-11 19:38:49

CivicMan
Member
Registered: 18-01-09
Posts: 69

Re: Appalled

Getting just like UKDIC......   roll

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#16 10-07-11 19:49:49

dth-adi
Verified Member
Registered: 19-09-04
Posts: 1,402

Re: Appalled

I know full well the reason for the inaccuracy built into speedos.

If a driver with such knowledge chooses to use that margin to their perceived advantage in their driving plan, that's fine with me.

Don't, however, complain when the actions of others challenge such decisions and leave them without a safe margin.

They choose - and accept the consequence!!

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#17 10-07-11 20:12:40

christhedrummer
Verified Member
Registered: 18-10-06
Posts: 1,163
Website

Re: Appalled

travelling at 77mph gauge indicated. 70mph sat nav indicated

Haven't quite worked out why you thought it was necessary to mention this unless you wanted to start an 'I'm better than you' style argument which is what you've done.

Out of interest, how did you get your speedo calibrated and how do you know your sat-nav is accurate?

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#18 10-07-11 21:54:46

Zipper
Verified Member
From: Darwin, Northern Territory Aus
Registered: 20-08-04
Posts: 2,690
Website

Re: Appalled

A local instructor teaches in a Subaru WRX (his previous Subaru was a standard one with WRX badges, he told his students it was a real WRX. His current Subi is a the real McCoy).
IMO and that of others he's immature and a dangerous cowboy, he takes some of his lads down to the racetrack and says things like "speed limit signs are stupid they take your eyes off the road" and "L-plates attract police" (he's often tailed by police during a lesson, I wonder why?).

Like me he has type 2 diabetes and you have to be careful with your diet as one of the potentially dangerous symptoms is falling asleep during a lesson on a warm day.
This instructor once fell asleep and woke up to find his student had taken him down to some mud flats and was having fun tearing up the joint in the WRX!


Zipper ("G'Day Mate!")
I'm not 65! I'm only $59.95+tax
www.drivingnt.com

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#19 10-07-11 21:57:32

Zipper
Verified Member
From: Darwin, Northern Territory Aus
Registered: 20-08-04
Posts: 2,690
Website

Re: Appalled

P.S. once again a perfectly good OP is being picked apart to the point of stupidity,.


Zipper ("G'Day Mate!")
I'm not 65! I'm only $59.95+tax
www.drivingnt.com

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#20 11-07-11 06:25:08

Roadmaster
Verified Member
Registered: 04-03-04
Posts: 5,670

Re: Appalled

P.S. once again a perfectly good OP is being picked apart to the point of stupidity,.

When you post such contentious statements you know full well that they will be challenged. 

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#21 11-07-11 07:45:38

Promanade
Guest

Re: Appalled

When you post such contentious statements you know full well that they will be challenged.

And when you do challenge such statements some of those challenges then get deleted. So is this a forum where everyone must agree with everyone else?

#22 11-07-11 07:59:53

Roadmaster
Verified Member
Registered: 04-03-04
Posts: 5,670

Re: Appalled

Has any been deleted from this thread? 

The only deleted posts  I know of recently were the personal insults on another thread.

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#23 11-07-11 08:26:12

pegasus
Verified Member
From: north west
Registered: 25-02-05
Posts: 3,299

Re: Appalled

Hi

And of course sat navs do not read the true speed on an incline, the steeper the incline the greater the disparity. (ie they give a lower reading).

roadhog

Would you care to quantify that error?
ie compare the difference on 25%,  10% or 5% gradients.

The most obvious problem I have found with SatNav speed is the lag when accelerating or braking.
In steady driving I am happy to use it as a more accurate guide than the speedo.

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#24 11-07-11 08:33:48

dth-adi
Verified Member
Registered: 19-09-04
Posts: 1,402

Re: Appalled

..............it would be perfectly reasonable to compensate for any inaccuracy found. (BTW, those resources are all around you and could even be used to calibrate a GPS).

Perfectly reasonable from the point of view of avoiding prosecution for speed but shouldn't the perspective and actions of an advanced driver/rider be wider than that!

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#25 11-07-11 09:41:12

martin_t
Verified Member
Registered: 30-12-06
Posts: 357

Re: Appalled

I don't understand your point dth. If one knows that one is travelling at or below the speed limit what does it matter how that is determined?

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