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#1 18-10-08 15:32:17

Cat8t3
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From: Droitwich - Worcestershire
Registered: 28-08-07
Posts: 339

Core Competencies

Hi Guys

Could someone please help me with the Core Competencies. I get the Fault Identification - Say what you see. I get the Remedial Action - Tell them how to do it next time. Its just im having trouble with regards to the Fault Analysis and what it is i should be explaining. Is there an easier way of rememebering what it is i should be explaining on this part. Its the word anaylis that im not getting.

Cat


1st Check Test 15/09/2010 - Grade 4
2nd Check Test 09/01/2013 - Grade 4

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18-10-08 15:32:17

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Re: Core Competencies




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#2 18-10-08 15:58:21

tony adi
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From: Selby
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Re: Core Competencies

Why is it a fault.


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#3 18-10-08 16:13:18

DampDog
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Re: Core Competencies

Always point out any real or potential dangers with the fault. What caused it? Misjudgment, miss-understanding, lack of knowledge, nerves etc. etc. Best way (or ways) to stop it happening again.


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#4 18-10-08 18:11:12

timmanwaringadi
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#5 18-10-08 20:19:36

KevB
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From: Amesbury
Registered: 06-06-08
Posts: 1,725
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Re: Core Competencies

My interpretations

Fault ID :- Recognise a fault has occurred.

Fault Analysis :- Understand how/why the fault occured, and how/why it deviated from the expected.

Remedial Action :-Explain potential/actual consequences.
Educate as to correct procedure, and give guidance whilst practicing.

In simple terms,
(ID) WHAT occured
(Analysis) WHY  it occured
(Remedy) HOW to do it correctly/overcome.

regards Dimmy.

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#6 18-10-08 21:14:10

hector
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From: Manchester
Registered: 04-04-06
Posts: 2,097
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Re: Core Competencies

Cat in adittion you MUST add on the dangers within your analysis even if obvious, never tell at phase 2 always ask first and only then tell if you need to. Keep it simple and tell at phase 1.

Analysis is very very simple why did it happen and why was it dangerous or potentially dangerous. The why is much more important at phase 2 than one.


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#7 18-10-08 23:22:35

tony adi
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From: Selby
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Re: Core Competencies

One thing to remember with core competencies (and where most PDI's go wrong). They are the basis for everything else. Understand them BEFORE you worry about PST's or part 3.

With the analysis (or why to keep it simple - nice to see everyone agreeing for a change by the way wink), another area where PDI's go wrong is simply that they don't know why. You must have a thorough understanding of why doing things the wrong way is a fault.

Quite often people go through part 2 being told by their trainer that they must drive to a certain standard to pass. They are not told why that standard is required, simply that it is the standard. They then go onto part 3 and are immediately bombarded with the concept of core competencies and PST's. The groundwork for part 3, and for learning how to teach, should start with your part 2 (or earlier) training being aimed more at understanding why. Much of the basic theory is contained in the part 1 study material, but most training companies simply provide DVD's or even worse a list of questions and answers with the "advice" to learn them. The first real training contact comes with part 2 training, this is an opportunity to really start the teaching process that is often overlooked. Too much emphasis on simply passing a test. It really is no wonder that so many struggle with part 3, when so much of the training process is fundamentally flawed to start with. The "system" is geared to each stage as a seperate entity (particularily with ORDIT), when in reality all three stages are linked.

In too many cases (there are of course exceptions) the whole training system is wrong. That's why people struggle with part 3.


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#8 19-10-08 08:40:13

ijmoore
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From: Staffordshire
Registered: 25-10-06
Posts: 1,077
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Re: Core Competencies

The analysis (why) is an important bit! It is the bit which creates understanding, analysing why its a problem. Explain and discuss the risk envolved, why they may have missed something.

Common ones like not checking mirrors before slowing for ex... What... Did you realise you did not check your mirror before you slowed down? (usually they say I did check it!) yes you did check it, but not before you slowed. Why is that an issue? (analysis) oh they say cos they car behind. Yes I say but why do you need your mirror? Oh I suppose you need to know how close they are and how fast they are going before you slow. (if they're good) then how to prevent it from happening. What about before you move your feet you move your eyes? Remember act like a puppet! Like you have a wire linking your feet to your eyes! I'd finish that off with an excise with commentary on mirrors in a busy place with loads of hazards to slow for!


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#9 19-10-08 12:01:58

Cat8t3
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From: Droitwich - Worcestershire
Registered: 28-08-07
Posts: 339

Re: Core Competencies

Thank you ever so much everyone smile You have all given me sound advice..Not that i would expect anything less of course,  big_smile

cheers Guys  big_smile


1st Check Test 15/09/2010 - Grade 4
2nd Check Test 09/01/2013 - Grade 4

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#10 19-10-08 12:09:13

hector
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Re: Core Competencies

Just remember dont go overboard on why on phase 1 on part 3. Its usually simple, havnt done it before! Or if your correcting a fault your not giving enough or the correct remedial advice. Same with new learners developing new skills, the why is less important and obvious, and to keep asking why would destroy a new learner.

Once someone knows and has practiced something the why becomes paramount.


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#11 19-10-08 13:19:14

KevB
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From: Amesbury
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Re: Core Competencies

Tony,

I think that post is post of the month.

I'd go further than that, I'd say the information and concepts you commented on should be in the introduction of every driver training manual printed.

all too often I cringe when I hear or read ADI's and trainers saying, "You past part 1 so you know the theory, and you passed part 2 so you know how to do it correctly, part 3 is just about teaching someone to do things the way you do them".

Someone can easily pass part 1 by knowing the answers to a question without knowing WHY that answer is correct, or why the alternative answers are incorrect.

Someone can easily pass a driving test of any standard by demonstrating during that test an ability to drive the way the examiner would expect a driver to behave in those conditions at that time.
That does not actually demonstrate an ability to understand WHY the driver SHOULD be driving in that way, nor in fact that it was the "correct" way at all, merely that the driver demonstrated a level of drive that was above that which would be a fail.

Neither test is a test of UNDERSTANDING driving or instruction.

To say an ADI merely needs to teach someone to do the things they do is misleading, if the ADI does not appreciate WHY they do what they do.

Anlaysis is all about cause and effect. Understanding an effect and how it relates to the expected or defined outcome and the causes of such effects.

so far on this thread, we have been phasing explainations in the past tense.
What OCCURRED and WHY it OCCURRED.
Good instruction is more than this. It is understanding what may occur in any given scenario, and then anticipating and observing to see if causes are occuring that may lead to the expected outcome at an early stage and thus being able to pre-empt a fault developing.
Proaction rather than reaction. Q+A is a good method of proactive analysis.

It's amazing how many kerb strikes can be avoided by the instructor anticipating the potential for it merely by asking about a reference point for parking at the kerb.

An instructor may not have struck the kerb once on his part 2. Does that mean he knows and understands the potential for a kerb strike, or how he is in fact avoiding a kerbstrike?
I do not believe so.
It merely demonstrated that he did not strike the kerb, it does not demostrate that he was actively considering the consequences of striking the kerb, why it should be avoided and how to avoid it.

WHAT - WHY- HOW is not just about What happened why it happend and how to avoid it, it is also about what can or may occur, why it can or may occur and how to avoid it.

Just think how much better a drive the part 2 could have been if the PDI understood the core comps BEFORE taking their own driving test, because I know so many that simply did not to any great degree, and yet still passed part 2.

regards, Dimmy.

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#12 19-10-08 13:45:26

ijmoore
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Re: Core Competencies

Spot on dimmy! Just shows I remember going through the process of 1,2 and part 3. PSTs all the way, no core comps! Shows the unprofessional nature of some instructors and the industry. Some brilliant some very poor! Being on ordit and better training generally!


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#13 19-10-08 20:08:01

Cat8t3
Verified Member
From: Droitwich - Worcestershire
Registered: 28-08-07
Posts: 339

Re: Core Competencies

Just think how much better a drive the part 2 could have been if the PDI understood the core comps BEFORE taking their own driving test, because I know so many that simply did not to any great degree, and yet still passed part 2.

You're right, I passed my Part 2 and didnt understand Core Comps, as my post has just proved. But i do believe i have a good trainer and have every faith in his ability to teach me how to become a good ADI.


1st Check Test 15/09/2010 - Grade 4
2nd Check Test 09/01/2013 - Grade 4

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#14 19-10-08 20:16:28

ijmoore
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From: Staffordshire
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Posts: 1,077
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Re: Core Competencies

Totally! Part 1 should include the theory of driving .... And the  theory of driving instruction. Then part 2 is putting the theory of driving in to practice (including understanding how the thoery of driving instruction translates into methods of driving inc ref points, and reasoning behind techniques (of course trainer using core comps)

Finally part 3 putting it all into play!


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#15 19-10-08 20:42:50

tony adi
Verified Member
From: Selby
Registered: 12-05-08
Posts: 1,233
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Re: Core Competencies

Tony,

I think that post is post of the month.

I'd go further than that, I'd say the information and concepts you commented on should be in the introduction of every driver training manual printed.

Awww shucks you've made me blush 3.gif

Maybe I should copyright it as well, fiver says it'll be a2om's "new" concept next week  big_smile big_smile big_smile big_smile big_smile

More seriously though, in the same way that teaching pupils simply to pass a test is generally regarded as poor practice, teaching PDI's to pass a test is poor practice. A brief glimpse through the questions asked on these forums is testimony to that. Most PDI's when they start out (and this is in no way intended as an insult to them, rather those that train them) have absolutely no idea how to teach people to drive.

Is there any other trade or industry (I refuse to call this a profession) where the training standards are so lax?

The vast majority of those starting out on part 3 are told they have to "do" 40 hours training. The vast majority of this (certainly with the larger training schools) is taken up with PST's and how to give briefings and all the ways the SE may try to catch them out on part 3. In other words they're being taught to pass a test. They are not being taught how to teach.

Again no offence to anyone training to be an ADI, do keep asking questions (it is a compliment to you that you want to know more).


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“Criticism may not be agreeable, but it is necessary. It fulfills the same
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