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#251 25-07-07 18:44:15

pj
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From: surrey
Registered: 27-02-05
Posts: 1,794

Re: PDI to ADI, my Story

oh god , yes this is the fustrating bit...waiting for the postman....SE's over there are evil :evil: :evil: lol


PJ Dip DI

if you always do what you've always done, you'll always get what you've always got.

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25-07-07 18:44:15

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Re: PDI to ADI, my Story




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#252 25-07-07 18:56:04

JonnyG
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From: Belfast
Registered: 13-01-05
Posts: 742
Website

Re: PDI to ADI, my Story

Got back now, but Ive gotta go out again. Will write up later, I have it all jottwed down so I dont forget.

Ill tell you I got pst5 emergency stop and progress/hesitancy.

Got a good feeling.

Later.........

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#253 25-07-07 20:58:07

june315
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From: south-East London
Registered: 13-12-05
Posts: 169

Re: PDI to ADI, my Story

How long do you have to wait for your letter? Hope it's not too long. I'm on my 2nd trip round and have gained much encouragement from reading your post. good luck Johnny.


22/06/07 - part 1 - 93% 64
31/07/07 - part 2 - passed 3m
11/05/09 - part 3 - 4/4

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#254 25-07-07 23:59:38

posh
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Registered: 21-01-06
Posts: 855

Re: PDI to ADI, my Story

fingers crossed  smile

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#255 26-07-07 00:30:21

JonnyG
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From: Belfast
Registered: 13-01-05
Posts: 742
Website

Re: PDI to ADI, my Story

ok here it is. ...

Met examiner...female and first day on the job for her(dunno if thats good or not)

Phase1 Emergency stop and use of rear view mirrors.

In test centre did a quick recap on types of mirrors and when to use them, asking questions. Then asked her to do cpd...messed about with main mirror, adjusting with 1 hand, put it too low, then too much to the offside, then when I said to frame the back window she got it. then same thing with offside mirror.

Out of tc gates left emerge. She was shuffling the steering wheel, but quickly fixed that 1. Left emerge next with no left mirror check. 3 questioned which we need to check, answered correctly, then asked why, she didnt know, so filled her in with correct answer...make sure its safe to turn. Right turn at traffic lights, again no right mirror, same questions, same answers. Pelican crossing asked why check mirrors? right answer. Right turn and signalled as I was giving the instruction. Asked the 2 qs again this time 2 right answers.Had to wait for 2 cars, prompted the right mirror b4 completing the turn. I was then asked to pull up on the left, again no left mirror, again asked why it was important, gave mecorrect answer, and I encouraged her to remember next time.

Emergency stop briefing approx 5 mins, 1 practice with feet and she looked down at her feet. Q&A about why we cant do that...prompted the correct answer out of her.. 1st stop in 2nd gear was slow reaction, and a late clutch with stall. Asked her to pull in, but went to move off without checking with car approaching behind. Immedaitly stopped her, car passed and eventually got in to side. Chatted about clutch timing and said Id help by saying "stop, and clutch" (thanks John Farlam) she agreed and off we went, trying not to check before moving off, but reminded her.  2nd stop...again a late reaction, and clutch perfect. Both these stops she was ok on the brakes. Prompted about moving off checks.  Left turn this time checked both mirrors, but far too early, so asked her to re-check. Emerge straight at crossroads with position in middle.  3rd stop...was saying stop and clutch but clutch went in first, then came off an on the brakes, with  late reaction, a real mess that 1!. Pulled up and started chattin about her position at the crossroads, corrected her wrong answer, then went to move her off again without mentioning the stop. She threw me a lifeline by asking how her emergency stop went? doh.  I practised the quick reaction on the pedals. Discussed progressive braking, and brake before clutch and seemed to understand about both.  Move off again and checks were done properly this time. Left emerge at crossroads, prompted her position and also correctly checked left mirror.   4th stop 3rd gear this time with no "stop and clutch", just back to "stop" done it well and moved off properly, pulled over to praise and start re-cap as it was now 3.27. She asked me to turn her left at T-junction, MSM properly and 5th stop was excellent, pulled in again to praise bu asked me to ask her to turn left then pull up again,no need to do any more stops. Did MsM properly recapped and she felt good.

Phase2 Progress, Hesitancy, Road Position.
Asked what problems she was having or wot her instructor had said. she said she found her speed awareness difficult.
Cpd and drive on...Left turn ok, left emerge crossroads ok, right turn ok, then hesitant on left emerge I Q&A about observations and preparation for junctions. Through pelican and straight at traffic lights, all ok. Approaching roundabout to go 2nd left...prompted about obs and speed on approach, but still missed 1st gap. after we completed rAb talked about judging a safe gap. (I confused myself by saying if a car at the entrance to our right is stopped, its likely there is a car approaching further round, so we could possibly go before it comes round, but if the car was coming on then we could follow it!! I knew what I meant, but was confusing for her and ahe responded with, "so if theres a car approaching we can go?" I then made it clearer (i think). By this time she was driving at 20mph in a 30 zone. We discussed how you know if its safe to do speed limit.  Left turn at traffic lights onto dual carriageway with 40 limit. At the lights I took the opportunity to ask her if she'd been on the road before. she said she had, then asked her if she knew the speed limitand she said "its more than 30" lights changed and I pointed to 40 sign round corner.  She was a bit slow at picking up speed, and messed up a gear change, and eventually ended up doing a 3rd to 5th at 40mph. Next left wheel was along cycle lane. Asked about where to look didnt know how to stay striaght so asked her to look as far ahead as poss and check wing mirrors.  We came through a pelican and traffic lights easing off perfectly to 35ish.  LEft turn at trafficlights onto 30 limit again. again took the opportunity to ask about speed limit and she asked me how I knew it would be 30 and I said "I bring all my pupils here and just know" But she drove at 25mph, asked about dangers of going too slow and seemed to understand as a car passed us (gift).
She then started driving on the drains and prompted her back into position (she was looking at kerb)
Left turn at trafficlights and I asked her to tell me as she was driving along when it was unsafe to drive at the speed limit...we turned and got up to 30, nicely into 4th gear and kept safe distnce from parked cars.  Approaching a petrol station with pelican crossing was where she said it was unsafe...I praised her for that one! 3rd exit at same roundabout as before, this time better judgemnt, then touching cycle lane again because she was looking at it.  Left turn at trafficlights and was slow to move away on green. we discussed watching the other traffic slowing and being prepared. Through a narrow road at 20mph which was good.  Left turn again and then a second left with parked cars both sides and brow of hill, she kept a good speed throughout and praised a lot for that. Left emerge and a huge gap (prob about 10 sec) betwen cars but hesitant...the gap was so big I could still prompt her into it successfully. I asked  about how we judge if safe to emerge into flow, and helped her by giving a 7-8 second gap as a guide.  By now we were doing 30 but car in front was doing 35 so there was 7-8 secs between us (gift, again) she said "so if i wait 7-8 seconds then I can go" ( thought that was a good one!)
Right turn towards test centre judged a gap perfectly then confirmed it by getting her to watch for the car passing the end of thbe road in her mirror.  Narrow road with 2 cyclists, no cycle lane this time. Passed them on wider part with no help, back up to 30mph and Left turn at trafficlights. Same road as the drain touching, but this time ok. Left turn into a meet situation, straightaway he flashed her through, she hesitated and he reflashed. I encouraged her to go on, but quickly realised why she was hesitant, there was barely enough room to get through. I tried to redeem myself by saying " really he should have realsied it was better for him to come on back there" she said " thats why I waited"
Right turn ok, crossroads ok, left emerge and I relaxed slightly and forgot to prompt about early obs and she stopped and missed a gap. There were loads of parked cars on he right making it difficult to see and she said she was trying to use the 7 seconds but couldnt see the cars well enough. Discussed peep and creep.
Left at trafficlights ok, right turn itno test centre street, with no cars to cross she stopped short of the turning. Got her into carpark and chatted about the turn. Turns out she was afraid of the 4x4 who was over the line pulling out on her.
Quick recap and end.

Postal strike means I may get a phonecall this time with my result if I havnt got it within 5 days.
What fun.

feeling confident, will ring friday saying I didnt get any post and ask for the result.

Thanks for reading and the support.

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#256 26-07-07 11:56:30

Dimmy
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Re: PDI to ADI, my Story

Hi Jonny smile
Thanks for the write-up.

I'm fairly sure many people are delaying responding to your post until you have your results through, hence no one posting before my response.

I notice you thank John Farlam during your post, have you had any sessions with him, and if so, how many and what areas of your tuition has he been helping you with?

You have included a lot of detail in your account, and it reads as though the SE was throwing a lot of lifelines your way, which you must have taken some comfort from.

Might I ask what you mean by 7 secong gap? That's an awfully long time if you are using it in relation to emerging. I think the SE's lifeline regarding this was her telling you she didnt know how to apply it in the situation she found herself in and perhaps was looking for an alternative timescale.  "Walk across and back again" may have sufficed.

Do you believe she was whitelining the cycle lane because she was looking too short. If so, did she have a reference point to use, as your writeup only refers to looking further ahead. Looking ahead but using the whiteline as a focal point would naturally make her to drift towards the whiteline and be counter productive without also using short and medium distance reference points too.
Do you feel by saying "I bring all my pupils here and just know" will help her when she is driving on her own when you will not be sat beside her? She was asking for a way for her to be able to confirm the speed limit for ANY road she finds herself on and not sure of the limit.

I raise just a few points regarding your write-up as  snippets just to add bulk to my response, but there are a number of issues regarding your performance and assistance you gave to both "pupils" that a good trainer would be able to help you with.

I really do wish you well, and you know you will always have my support, but comparing your writeup with not just mine but but also to your own previous attempts, I feel you did not do so well as one or 2 of your previous goes, for either phase.

I realise I am talking out of turn, especially as you have not had the result as yet, and certainly dont want you to think I am being critical for the sake of doing so, but a week is a long time for you to believe you did better on this occasion than on previous when to a bystander like myself, your writeup lacks certain qualities of your previous ones.
Pass or fail, you know I will continue to support you and am always here to offer that support and help if you feel you may benifit from it.

Chin up mate, and best wishes smile


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#257 26-07-07 12:54:01

JonnyG
Verified Member
From: Belfast
Registered: 13-01-05
Posts: 742
Website

Re: PDI to ADI, my Story

Dimmy.
My write up was detailed in terms of route directions etc and faults committed.  I couldnt remember every exact detail of the analysis used but I will fill in a few more blanks and see what you think.

I notice you thank John Farlam during your post, have you had any sessions with him, and if so, how many and what areas of your tuition has he been helping you with?

I went to see John after I failed my 3rd part3 for 1 day with the aim of going for an additional day before my 4th attempt. I increased that and did his full 3 day course in June and he helped me relax and realise that I was doing everything as I should be and gave me belief in myself.

Might I ask what you mean by 7 secong gap? That's an awfully long time if you are using it in relation to emerging. I think the SE's lifeline regarding this was her telling you she didnt know how to apply it in the situation she found herself in and perhaps was looking for an alternative timescale.  "Walk across and back again" may have sufficed.

In this particular incident, I used the 7 second thing but Ive never ever used that before, so I guess it just came out as what i felt helped her at the time. If I were to walk across that particular road and back again it would have taken about 15 seconds, even with no traffic. The time gap was in relation to the space between two cars and not how far from the junction the car was.  The second time this happened she was hesitant because she didnt peep and creep effectivly to be able to see the traffic properly.

Do you believe she was whitelining the cycle lane because she was looking too short. If so, did she have a reference point to use, as your writeup only refers to looking further ahead. Looking ahead but using the whiteline as a focal point would naturally make her to drift towards the whiteline and be counter productive without also using short and medium distance reference points too.

I used looking at the middle of the lane ahead, between the lorry wheels, then when she went round a righthand bend she said, I cant see the lorry wheels anymore. I replied to keep her eyes to the left of the right hand bend. This seemed to be ok as she was in a good position from then on on that particular road.  This was the biggest fault I feel i didnt fix as quickly as I would have liked, because it happened twice again,but eventually got there.

Do you feel by saying "I bring all my pupils here and just know" will help her when she is driving on her own when you will not be sat beside her? She was asking for a way for her to be able to confirm the speed limit for ANY road she finds herself on and not sure of the limit.

On this occasion we were at a major crossroads traffic light junction turning left. We were 1st at lights and I asked about what we expect to see a new one of as we came into the new road...we could also clearly see the 30 sign to the road on our right, which I pointed out, she said does that mean its like a reminder for this road (our left) This I confirmed and that was when the lights changed and she saw the sign. The comment about my pupils was just a lighthearted remark after the above events.

I appreciate you comments, and I did do the write up at about 1 in the morning and didnt include every single thing, just what stood out.

Thanks as ever for the support.

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#258 26-07-07 15:56:59

Lexy
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From: Surrey
Registered: 06-01-05
Posts: 208
Website

Re: PDI to ADI, my Story

Oh Jonny... the suspense must be killing you... it is me!!

Come on Post Man!  :evil:

Got everything crossed for you. smile

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#259 26-07-07 18:24:15

Trumper
Verified Member
From: South west
Registered: 11-07-05
Posts: 251

Re: PDI to ADI, my Story

Great write up Jonny. I wish you all the very best.


O.R.D.I.T. Dip D.I
Fleet reg
A.D.I  Car manual
Cardington A , D.I.A Special test, R.O.S.P.A , I.A.M

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#260 29-07-07 22:01:56

JonnyG
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From: Belfast
Registered: 13-01-05
Posts: 742
Website

Re: PDI to ADI, my Story

4/3. Bit confused bout the marks though cos I was marked as 6 in phase1 and 4 in phase2 for instructors use of controls and never even went near them or talked about them.

Nothing more to say right now. Totally frustrated and angry. Ive got my wedding in 2 weeks and still not everything ready for that, internet has been down past couple of days (thanks orange) and a couple of friends were in the youth group I helped run, their dad has suddenly died on Thursday afternoon.

Im just p55d off with everything right now, and im stealing wireless internet from next door who is unsecured...

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#261 29-07-07 22:29:22

posh
Verified Member
Registered: 21-01-06
Posts: 855

Re: PDI to ADI, my Story

reall bad news jonny. so close.  cant imagine how dissapointed you are. but you will get there in the end. Have a wee break and concentrate on your wedding. After that you will be refreshed . and will get it next time .

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#262 30-07-07 06:38:14

Lucky245
Verified Member
From: N.Ireland
Registered: 09-05-07
Posts: 119

Re: PDI to ADI, my Story

Devastated for you Jonny as you know, Concentrate on the wedding now and post mortem your result when your less annoyed and enjoying early married life.

wink


"Just because you don't like the answer doesn't mean its wrong!!!"

RoADA Gold

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#263 30-07-07 13:40:51

june315
Verified Member
From: south-East London
Registered: 13-12-05
Posts: 169

Re: PDI to ADI, my Story

So sorry to hear your news Jonny. As already said forget about it for now and concentrate on your wedding return to it after a break when you're refreshed. Good luck for the future


22/06/07 - part 1 - 93% 64
31/07/07 - part 2 - passed 3m
11/05/09 - part 3 - 4/4

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#264 30-07-07 13:54:37

Shrek
Verified Member
From: South Wales
Registered: 28-02-05
Posts: 255

Re: PDI to ADI, my Story

Hiya Jonny, really sorry to hear your news buddy.
Like the others have said, try to concentrate on the wedding for now and throw yourself into the run up for that, you can take a good breather after it and then look at the 'post mortem' verdict.
You know, when you think that we both started training at about the same time and we've both been through so much over the last couple of years (as have so many others!) one of the things that kept me going sometimes has been reading the stuff you've put down here.  smile
You've earned a bit of a breather mate, take it. You'll come back refreshed and ready to hit the road again.
Cheers buddy and keep your chin up, Shrek.



Carry on Donkey -  you're going the right way for a smacked bottom!

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#265 30-07-07 15:25:16

pj
Verified Member
From: surrey
Registered: 27-02-05
Posts: 1,794

Re: PDI to ADI, my Story

oh poo!!! when can you do it again :? obviously enjoy the wedding, go on honeymoon and then come back and get that badge  wink


PJ Dip DI

if you always do what you've always done, you'll always get what you've always got.

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#266 30-07-07 16:48:37

Andi
Member
Registered: 21-10-05
Posts: 1,382

Re: PDI to ADI, my Story

so sorry to hear your news Johnny, enjoy the summer, your wedding and honeymoon, then get back into part 3 mode.....keep ur chin up and dont get too disheartened.

xx andi xx


1.gif

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#267 30-07-07 18:01:25

tmg555
Verified Member
Registered: 01-11-06
Posts: 441

Re: PDI to ADI, my Story

I know how you are feeling, nothing anyone can say will make you feel any better, i feel for you, try and forget about it for now, you will crack it next time mate. Best wishes.


Les Hayes
Approved Driving Instructor
For driving lessons in and around the Reading area
www.hayes-driving-lessons.co.uk
Tel 0118 9626 473

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#268 30-07-07 19:05:54

stsmith2212
Verified Member
From: BIRMINGHAM
Registered: 14-08-05
Posts: 83

Re: PDI to ADI, my Story

Sorry to hear your result never got you that green badge you so much deserve.
Good Luck with your wedding and future

Sandra x


Part 3...April 10th.... 2-2      Delayed success
Part 3...June 22nd......4-3     Delayed success
Part 3...Nov 09th ... 3-3        Delayed success

If at first you don't succeed, try and try again!

2nd time around...

Part 1... Passed March 07   1st time
Part 2....Failed March 07
Part 2....Passed May 07
Part 3....Failed Jan 18th 08
Part 3....Failed March 08
Part 3....I think its all over.... IT IS NOW!  Failed oct 08

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#269 30-07-07 19:41:48

standon11
Verified Member
From: doncaster
Registered: 30-11-06
Posts: 632

Re: PDI to ADI, my Story

really sorry to hear your news johnny.iv'e read your posts with interest since i found the forum & took heart from them.i failed my first 2 attempts & felt like packing it all in,but reading your posts & i think tmg555 aswell who had to bounce back gave me the determination to carry on.as others have said put it on the back burner for a few weeks,enjoy your wedding & come back refreshed to go again.

chris

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#270 30-07-07 19:56:19

keith williams
Verified Member
From: Bangor, Northern Ireland
Registered: 28-08-06
Posts: 458

Re: PDI to ADI, my Story

Having trained with Jonny for the last while on his part3 stuff I can tell you all that he was more prepared for this one than ever before. He really really deserved it this time.

4/3 wasn't a fair result this time round at all.

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#271 31-07-07 13:36:29

keefidee
Verified Member
From: south east wales
Registered: 25-11-06
Posts: 510
Website

Re: PDI to ADI, my Story

Sorry to hear your news Jonny, sometimes life does not seem fair. However as has been said previously, enjoy your wedding and honeymoon then get back and show what you a made of.
I am sure everyone on the forum is supporting you.

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#272 24-08-07 22:32:11

posh
Verified Member
Registered: 21-01-06
Posts: 855

Re: PDI to ADI, my Story

how did the wedding go jonny  smile hope it all went well for you.

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#273 18-10-07 11:19:05

JonnyG
Verified Member
From: Belfast
Registered: 13-01-05
Posts: 742
Website

Re: PDI to ADI, my Story

Hey all. I just realised that I left this topic go dormant for a bit.
I had intended to update you on the debrief from the SE which I had just before the wedding, (which was a pouring day in August, but the  sun was inside us!)

The SE said that I was very close, but mainly just under instructed in phase 2 because I didnt give the help required. The position fault was caused because she wasnt aware of the dangers of driving too close to the kerb/cycle lane.  I had simply been asking the wrong questions to analyse the fault.  She didnt like me using a moving vehicle ahead as a refrence point for positioning in lanes, as when they go round a corner the ref point moves. 

The hesitacy problem wasnt  corrected, because she was confused by the way I worded the way to judge the gap in approaching vehicles when emerging. (I knew what I meant, but didnt explain it correctly, and should have pulled up to explain it better before the next emerge.)

The dual control issue on the marking sheet was because on explaining the emergency stop I used my pedals to show how quick a reaction was required ( I actually didnt realise I did this, and she regarded it as demonstrating purposes ) On phase 2 I moved my left leg as I had been sitting akwardly, I noticed her looking at my feet and it had made her nervous, thinking I was going to use them. Guess I put that down to the inexperience of the SE.

Anyway I have a new date and will keep it to myself this time. 

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#274 18-10-07 13:35:53

L33d5.dr
Verified Member
From: Wakefield
Registered: 23-03-06
Posts: 93

Re: PDI to ADI, my Story

Sounds like a good idea keeping it to yourself,not as much pressure on you to pass.Good luck.

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#275 03-11-07 14:59:48

JonnyG
Verified Member
From: Belfast
Registered: 13-01-05
Posts: 742
Website

Re: PDI to ADI, my Story

Hey all.
Ive been very very quiet lately, not only on the forum, but also out on the roads with pupils,  since the summer my lessons per week has dropped from around 20 to sometimes just around 10, or even less.  Ive had a few get through tests, so its not all bad.  But just recently pupils have been unable to continue having lessons, 1 is scared of driving at nights, and I cant convince her that its totally safe.  Another 2 are going on holidays and need to save money, the usual lame reasons for not going out.  One pupil asked me how many more hours he would need for his test, and when I was honest with him he hasnt arranged any more lessons.
This lack of being out has left me feeling a bit out of practice and when I do go out, Im not teaching just as good as I should be.
i was out with Keith yesterday doing part 3 stuff and he made a fault which I couldnt be bothered about fixing, and Ive noticed that creeping into my pupils lesons too...
Not good news when i have Part 3 soon.

ive become complacent with the lack of work and then become lazy.

How do I get back into doing things properly with no practice??

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