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#1 28-12-04 05:40:24

jonks
Guest

Speeding whilst overtaking

I was told a few months ago by a friend that if you found yourself behind a car doing 35 in a 40, if you were to do 50mph to perform an overtake, you would not be breaking the law by breaking the speed limit.

Anyone know if this is true?

28-12-04 05:40:24

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Re: Speeding whilst overtaking



#2 28-12-04 06:43:47

Gizmotime
Administrator
From: Bolton Lancashire
Registered: 05-04-04
Posts: 1,963

Re: Speeding whilst overtaking

Well we have been told by the Police that if you have to go over by 2/3miles then thats ok but anything over that then No it's not ok.

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#3 28-12-04 09:07:12

Lynne
Verified Member
From: Essex
Registered: 05-03-04
Posts: 925

Re: Speeding whilst overtaking

Nice idea Jonks but wouldn't everyone use that excuse when caught on a speed camera in the outside lane??

I tend to agree with Giz.. this is my understanding too.  I also tell my pupils best go over just a couple of mph over speed limit to get out of someone's blind spot rather than sit there, especially when it's a lorry!!

Lynne

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#4 28-12-04 10:10:35

bigred
Verified Member
From: Kent
Registered: 25-02-04
Posts: 1,592
Website

Re: Speeding whilst overtaking

I've had examiner tell me that if, when overtaking, the other vehicle accelerates you can exceed the speed limit to finish the manouvre safely. This was in relation to a pupil who took the car upto 82mph (examiners words) on test and still passed.

It's a strange world!

Regards,

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#5 28-12-04 10:13:02

Midge
Member
From: Nottingham
Registered: 25-02-04
Posts: 414
Website

Re: Speeding whilst overtaking

Barry,  I had an SSE tell me the same thing, but it was many years ago, I wondered if they would still accept this.


Midge  -   Dip D.I.

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#6 28-12-04 10:52:01

jonks
Guest

Re: Speeding whilst overtaking

What I have been told is that it is legal to break the speed limit in order to safely complete a manoeuvre. this would not apply on a dual carriageway or motorway where going over the speed limit (in a perfect world) would not be required.

#7 28-12-04 12:48:03

bigred
Verified Member
From: Kent
Registered: 25-02-04
Posts: 1,592
Website

Re: Speeding whilst overtaking

Barry?

Who's he?

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#8 28-12-04 13:27:17

simonjones
Guest

Re: Speeding whilst overtaking

I remember reading somewhere that police drivers are above reproach . . . As I was driving at forty miles per hour in a forty mile an hour limit, a marked police car without it’s blues and twos going, tried to overtake me. The point being, the police are only human, whereas some will turn a blind eye to speeding whilst overtaking, others won’t.

Speeding is speeding.

We are taught that we should not overtake unless we know it to be safe to do so. I suggest this should be amended; we shouldn’t overtake unless it is both safe AND legal to do so. As far as plodders are concerned, patience is a virtue.


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#9 28-12-04 13:59:29

MrBassMan
Verified Member
From: Ceredigion, West Wales
Registered: 10-05-04
Posts: 669
Website

Re: Speeding whilst overtaking

On my part 2, I started overtaking a vehicle on the motorway and that vehicle started to speed up sightly, As I was doing 70MPH and he was starting to pull away from me, I let him go and then pulled in. I was praised during the debrief for doing that and not being tempted to exceed the speed limit to continue the overtake.

I would never advise speeding to overtake, if the vehicle in front is doing the speed limit - there is no need to overtake in the first place. If they are doing less than the speed limit then you should have no need to break the speed limit to get passed.


Learn 2 Pass
Driving lessons in and around Ceredigion in West Wales  http://www.L2P.co.uk

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#10 28-12-04 16:19:19

Midge
Member
From: Nottingham
Registered: 25-02-04
Posts: 414
Website

Re: Speeding whilst overtaking

So sorry,  Big Red, it must have been a senior moment :oops:
( I knew being this age would come in useful one day)  roll


Midge  -   Dip D.I.

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#11 28-12-04 18:49:13

jimbo
Guest

Re: Speeding whilst overtaking

A speed limit - like a stop junction - is a deffinite point.
    We can all find excuses for exceeding the points but that is still breaking the law so we should not kid ourselves about it.  Whether you feel that at times it is prudent to break the saw is a different question.

#12 28-12-04 21:28:46

Stephen7738
Member
From: Warrington
Registered: 12-10-04
Posts: 305

Re: Speeding whilst overtaking

Prior to starting your overtake one of the considerations should be can i carry out this manoeuvre safely and legal if the answer is no then it should not be done,I do accept however that to exceed the speed limit by a couple of miles an hour if this will allow the overtake to be complete safely rather than abort part way through which could be more dangerous it's all a matter of judgement.
                                       Stephen

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#13 29-12-04 17:15:22

buzdriver
Guest

Re: Speeding whilst overtaking

i was told when training to be a adi that if you plan correctly with your mirrors then you would be able to avoid.pulling out in front of speeding car. also when actualy over taking that if the car speeds up then you have to drop behind. but ive had a pupil fail a driving test for not letting a lorry overtake on a dual carrage way. so i dont get this one myself should the lorry have slowed and pulled in behind a car which is quicker than a lorry. speed limit was 70 and hgvs are limited to 56mph. so in my opinion the lorry should not have tried to over take he atempted this because it was a learner driver. bit harsh to be given a serous. what do you think?

#14 29-12-04 17:42:45

ExAdiNigel
Member
From: Plymouth, Devon
Registered: 13-12-04
Posts: 4,739

Re: Speeding whilst overtaking

If you need to exceed the speed limit to do an overtake, you shouldn't be overtaking.  As someone else said, if you are caught by a speed camera it wouldn't be a valid excuse you would still be done for it.

Nigel


National Standards Cycling Instructor, Ex Adi

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#15 29-12-04 17:48:34

jonks
Guest

Re: Speeding whilst overtaking

I would have thought that if you were overtaking on a normal single lane road, a speed camara would not get you anyway, and if it did, it would have no white lines to judge your speed because there would be another car blocking the view. Not that thats an excuse to do it. just a thought i had.


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#16 11-01-05 16:21:02

crr003
Guest

Re: Speeding whilst overtaking

jonks wrote:

I would have thought that if you were overtaking on a normal single lane road, a speed camara would not get you anyway, and if it did, it would have no white lines to judge your speed because there would be another car blocking the view. Not that thats an excuse to do it. just a thought i had.

But wouldn't the camera have been triggered by the car you were overtaking, so logically you were going even faster!  Good news would be the camera probably couldn't get your number plate  wink

Roger

#17 01-03-05 11:46:42

caenlochan
Guest

Re: Speeding whilst overtaking

I was recently caught on Camera on a Dual carriage way doing 79 miles per hour. The driving conditions were damp and a large amount of surface spray was being thrown up.

I came up behind a lorry which was creating a large amount of spray and made the decision to overtake. Once commited I realised that my vision was seriously impaired by increased levels of spray and accelerated to get past the lorry as quickly as possible hence increasing speed above limit.
Is this a defence I can use in court?

#18 01-03-05 13:38:22

Gizmotime
Administrator
From: Bolton Lancashire
Registered: 05-04-04
Posts: 1,963

Re: Speeding whilst overtaking

I wouldn't think so at all, With the weather conditions as you say you shopuld have planned your Overtake sooner.
Of course I'm not a Police Officer so can't say for certain.

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#19 01-03-05 17:39:11

ExAdiNigel
Member
From: Plymouth, Devon
Registered: 13-12-04
Posts: 4,739

Re: Speeding whilst overtaking

caenlochan wrote:

I was recently caught on Camera on a Dual carriage way doing 79 miles per hour. The driving conditions were damp and a large amount of surface spray was being thrown up.

I came up behind a lorry which was creating a large amount of spray and made the decision to overtake. Once commited I realised that my vision was seriously impaired by increased levels of spray and accelerated to get past the lorry as quickly as possible hence increasing speed above limit.
Is this a defence I can use in court?

You realised your vision was seriously impaired?  So you decided to accelerated further?  and Is this a defense you could use in court?  YES if you are planning to plead insanity! lol

The talk earlier in this  thread was, I think, getting confused between what an examiner may allow and what is legal.  It is not legal to break the speed limit to overtake someone.  If you need to break the speed limit to perform an overtake then you shouldn't perform the overtake!

Nigel


National Standards Cycling Instructor, Ex Adi

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#20 01-03-05 18:46:10

ADI349
Verified Member
From: East Yorkshire
Registered: 24-01-05
Posts: 193

Re: Speeding whilst overtaking

A speed limit is a speed limit you could usse all the excuses as mitigation perhaps but when I was a trtaffic officer that;s all they would be classed as. 

Ps
A police vehicle does not have to have it's blue lights flashing in order to exceed the speed limit if it is necessary in order to do the job.

Steve


If you only do what you've always done, you will only achieve what you've always achieved

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#21 26-09-05 07:19:13

bigears
Member
From: Northern Ireland
Registered: 14-09-05
Posts: 162

Re: Speeding whilst overtaking

jonks wrote:

I was told a few months ago by a friend that if you found yourself behind a car doing 35 in a 40, if you were to do 50mph to perform an overtake, you would not be breaking the law by breaking the speed limit.

Anyone know if this is true?

HI  Jonks,i placed a thread on (Adi Training)relating to a very similar situation.''it was placed in the wrong section'',oop's.but my point is very similar to the point you have made.'L' and restricted drivers (test passed) in N.Ireland are restricted to 45mph for their first year after qualifing.say for instance you get behind 2 or 3 of these drivers in front of you that may be behind a driver doing 50 mph on a single carriageway,this makes overtaking nearly impossible. :x


Two things are Infinite:The Universe and Human Stupidity;and I'm not sure about the Universe.

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#22 26-09-05 08:54:27

Django
Guest

Re: Speeding whilst overtaking

adiNigel wrote:

You realised your vision was seriously impaired?  So you decided to accelerated further?  and Is this a defense you could use in court?  YES if you are planning to plead insanity! lol

Quite right  lol 

Surely if your vision is impaired then maybe a better course of action would be to increase the gap between you and the offending vehicle to a point where your vision is improved.

Better to get somewhere slightly later than not get there at all wink

#23 09-10-05 15:24:03

JezzyB
Verified Member
From: West and North London
Registered: 08-10-05
Posts: 117

Re: Speeding whilst overtaking

In practice the law is the law(one would hope)!
BUT is it not there to be broken as they say?

The reason I raise this is that one a test i had a pupil fail (if i remember correctly) in guilford for not using a bus lane when there was a car comiing towards her (overtaking a bus on the opposite side) in her lane. I think he gave her a serious on a+p.
The DE stated that even though the bus lane was in use no court or police officer would find her guilty of offence as she was taking evasive action. i mentioned this to a friend and he raised the point that the highway code states 'DO NOT' use the bus lane when in opperation. It does not state 'unless in an emergency'. Therefore i should have had grounds to appeal as what the DE was implying was that it was correct to break the law, contary to the highway code. A bit of a minefield for a learner driver, esp. on a test!

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#24 09-10-05 18:29:46

ADI349
Verified Member
From: East Yorkshire
Registered: 24-01-05
Posts: 193

Re: Speeding whilst overtaking

In my opinion to DE was wrong.  It is alright sayong no court or police officer would give you a ticket but a camera would have one issued to you and unless the picture picked up the 'offending' vehicvle on the other carriagewat you would find it difficult to argue.

Steve W wink


If you only do what you've always done, you will only achieve what you've always achieved

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#25 30-10-05 20:01:23

Alibran
Guest

Re: Speeding whilst overtaking

If I had the choice between risking a head on collision with another vehicle or illegally using a bus lane, I'd choose the bus lane.  I enjoy living, and I'm sure every DE in the country does too.

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